Observation

Warnevada · #1 July 19th, 2017, 07:34 PM

I had an AT gun moving down a paved road blissfully unaware of a sniper lurking in the area. The sniper fired one shot which destroyed the AT gun AND killed the crew. The only way I can imagine this happening is if the one shot happened to explode the ammo supply -- highly unlikely, especially since the unit was moving.

I have noticed this in the past with infantry units, not snipers, firing rifles and destroying artillery and crews. I'm not sure what the rationale for this is, but realism certainly isn't it.

DRG · #2 July 19th, 2017, 08:26 PM

Killing the crew destroys the gun. That is SOP for the game. When the crew dies or is dispersed, the gun is destroyed as only that crew can operate that guns....no crew, no gun. It's possible there was only one crew left for that gun but the only way to know that is to post the save game

Imp · #3 July 20th, 2017, 06:05 AM

Limitations of the game system, crewed weapons are vulnerable as considered grouped round the weapon rather than dispersed as a squad could be.
Units can only have one state so as most of their time is spent stationary manning the weapon thats whats modeled.
They are very vulnerable therefore when moving or transported.
Not unfeasable as again restricted only that crew can man that gun.
If fired on by a sniper its fair to assume the crew would disperse to save themselves at least till the threat is neutralised, in game terms its out of action thats a kill.

Warnevada · #4 July 20th, 2017, 02:01 PM

This was a fully crewed gun which was moving up to the front. Hadn't been in action prior.

I can understand how destroying the crew would in effect destroy the gun. And I can accept that repeated small arms fire will do that. What is incredible to me is that a single shot could do it.

Ts4EVER · #5 July 20th, 2017, 02:11 PM

Is a single "shot" ingame also a single shot in real life terms? For instance, a machine gun "shot" is probably a burst. So maybe he shot 2 or 3 shots and the rest of the crew ditched the gun.

Mobhack · #6 July 20th, 2017, 03:45 PM

Since a sniper can kill several troops - its not 1 shot, its one engagement.

halstein · #7 July 21st, 2017, 10:34 AM

I'll always thought that when sniper takes out more than one troop, the rest are helping their wounded comrade to a first aid post, or running away.

If the gun was destroy, maybe it was let go into a ditch or something, making it inoperable until a visit in a workshop, or some-such.

Halstein

Warnevada · #8 July 21st, 2017, 07:44 PM

How long is a turn, 10 minutes? A sniper can fire six times in a turn, that's not quite 2 minutes per engagement. With observation and aiming maybe one round per minute. To kill an entire gun crew in one engagement, would require cooperation of the crew, like standing up in the open with a target on their chest.

An additional observation: a ten or twelve man squad armed with just a rifle is about the same effectiveness as a sniper, perhaps a bit less. Which means a sniper is ten or twelve times more effective as an infantryman. Perhaps, snipers are too strong in the game?

Mobhack · #9 July 21st, 2017, 08:42 PM

In the original game, snipers cost just one point.

We massively increased the cost - they are no longer cheap. Snipers aren't wonder weapons (highly vulnerable to artillery and if caught by other infantry at 1 hex or less (melee factor is negligible)).

Imp · #10 July 22nd, 2017, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warnevada

How long is a turn, 10 minutes? A sniper can fire six times in a turn, that's not quite 2 minutes per engagement. With observation and aiming maybe one round per minute. To kill an entire gun crew in one engagement, would require cooperation of the crew, like standing up in the open with a target on their chest.

An additional observation: a ten or twelve man squad armed with just a rifle is about the same effectiveness as a sniper, perhaps a bit less. Which means a sniper is ten or twelve times more effective as an infantryman. Perhaps, snipers are too strong in the game?

Begining to wonder why we answer your questions you never seemto read the answers!!
As mentioned he did not kill all or most of the crew or if he did it was a super rare snake eyes on all the rolls the game makes & he hit a grenade that went off, they disbanded & went to ground.

Regarding snipers in the game they are a nuisance harasing infantry but are priced accordingly, decent ones cost as much as a squad.
As said they are a pain as slows things down while you use anti sniper tactics but more often than not you can kill them before they have done damage equal to their cost so they are priced right.
Snipers main advantage is the fact they are size zero so hard to spot & kill & yes if positioned well they can sometimes be very effective.

If you dont like it change it I change the size of several units in the USA & USMC, dont agree with the likes of the coin infantry for the Bradleys or USMC fire teams being size 0.
They already have the advantage of being experience 80 & its easy enough with those nations to have the majority of your infantry units size zero so the AI does not stand a chance.