Anomaly reports

[Richard_H]

One of the (dubious?) joys of retirement is that, until I get my garden some time next year, I have little to devote my time to but shopping, cooking and SP. I have therefore taken some time to separate the unit spreadsheet into classes (how sad is that?!) if only to enhance my own oobs.

However, in the course of so doing, I will probably throw up various anomalies, if only because different oob designers have had their own ideas over the years. For example, Class 172 (Bicycle Squad) shows Finnish (oob 65) units 505, 506 and 507 as Size = 2, although other units of the same class (with more crew) are Size = 1.

Don/Andy, if stuff like this (and 90% of it will probably be this trivial, I've only just started) is useful, I'll continue to post it. If not, please let me know and I shan't waste your or my time.

Cheers

Richard H

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by Richard_H

One of the (dubious?) joys of retirement is that, until I get my garden some time next year, I have little to devote my time to but shopping, cooking and SP. I have therefore taken some time to separate the unit spreadsheet into classes (how sad is that?!) if only to enhance my own oobs.

However, in the course of so doing, I will probably throw up various anomalies, if only because different oob designers have had their own ideas over the years. For example, Class 172 (Bicycle Squad) shows Finnish (oob 65) units 505, 506 and 507 as Size = 2, although other units of the same class (with more crew) are Size = 1.

Don/Andy, if stuff like this (and 90% of it will probably be this trivial, I've only just started) is useful, I'll continue to post it. If not, please let me know and I shan't waste your or my time.

Cheers

Richard H

It's all useful stuff.

AFAIR, push bikes should be same size as cavalry (2 IIRC). Though I cannot se anyone sane actually using them outside a scenario where they were dumped on you !

(The French scooter with RCL is a cute little thing, though !)

Andy

[Richard_H]

Hi Andy

Thanks for that, will keep posting them in this thread.

The Swiss still have bikes up to 2020 - ideal terrain for them UI'd have actually gone for Size = 1: a man on a bike can put his feet on the ground, and if he's crouched over handlebars, he becomes smaller than his marching counterpart. Man on horse is much taller . . . .

Yes, I must try that little French machine

[Richard_H]

Denmark Units 356, 357 & 358 - have a Load Cost of 10, where other cyclist units have 0.

Sweden Unit 131 likewise.

Richard H

[Richard_H]

Unit Class 7 – AGL.

Iraq 335, Mujahedin 70 & 71, Afghanistan 70, E.Germany 97, Czechoslovakia 97, W.Germany 258, 259 & 262 have Load Cost = 1. The other 52 units all have Load Cost = 0.

E.Germany 97 has FC = 5. May be a super Zeiss sight they forgot to tell the Russians about . . . All other AGL apart from Poland 97 have FC = 1. The Polish unit has FC = 0, but it is a different weapon.

Israel 182 has AP rounds, as opposed to HEAT (yes, it’s a Mk.47 in Slot 1, same stats as other Mk.47s).

Great Britain 730 & 731 have Speed 5, whereas W.Germany 259 & 262 (same weapon) have Speed 4. And the Brits are carrying 20 more rounds (same crew size).

USA 774 & 775 have Crew 3, the other Mk.47s (USMC 776 & 783, Israel 182) have Crew 4. I can’t find a source that gives the correct number, although as it’s apparently 100 lb lighter than the Mk.19, I’d hazard a guess at 3.

In similar vein, of the 25 Mk.19s in game, a slight majority (13) have Crew 4. USA 95, 105 & 772, Greece 375, Turkey 378 & 379, Green 95, W.Germany 258, Argentina 97, Finland 90 and Indonesia 88 & 89 have 3.

Richard H

[Richard_H]

Unit Class 115 – Airmobile Section.

France 341 has an ISD of 1/82. However, formations do not appear until 1/86.


Unit Class 185 – Airmobile Heavy Infantry

Is only used by Poland; most of their other Airmobile units are paras, and they have no units in Class 97 (Paratroop Support). You could perhaps save a Unit Class here?

Richard H

[Pats]

Originally Posted by Richard_H

Hi Andy

Thanks for that, will keep posting them in this thread.

The Swiss still have bikes up to 2020 - ideal terrain for them UI'd have actually gone for Size = 1: a man on a bike can put his feet on the ground, and if he's crouched over handlebars, he becomes smaller than his marching counterpart. Man on horse is much taller . . . .

Yes, I must try that little French machine

ehm, the Swiss bycicle squads have actually been phased out I think around 2003

[Richard_H]

Units 178 USA & 178 USMC (Both LVT(A) 2): USA has Crew 2, USMC 4. Armour is USA Steel 2/1/1/2/1/1/0, HEAT 3/2/2/3/2/2/0, USMC Steel 2/2/2/2/2/2/1. HEAT 3/3/3/2/2/2/1. Looking at http://afvdb.50megs.com, which IMHO is generally pretty accurate, the USA armour is the correct version, and Crew is 3.

@ Pats: possibly IRL - in game you can cycle away till December 2020. Now get hoofing up those Alps

Richard H

[Richard_H]

Unit Class 33 – Light Amphibian

Netherlands 322 and Italy 203 (Both Bv.206): Dutch version has Crew 2, Lift Capacity 114, Weight 12, Smoke 0; Italian has Crew 4, Lift Capacity 115, Weight 11, Smoke 2. Both are available at the same time, no carry issues with either.

N.Yemen 219 & UN 235 have Survivability 0, other DUKWs in same class have 4. UN 235 & Peru 235 have Lift Capacity 25, other DUKWs in same class have 125.

France 234/235/236: Crew of 6/7 in a vehicle barely 10 feet by 5 . . . . .nah,can’t see it somehow.

Russia 185, Hungary 235 and Bulgaria 251 have 24, Red 240 has 14, all other ZiS/Zil-485s have Speed 20. The same culprits have Swim Speed 5 (All others have 3), Survivability 0 (Others have 4), Lift Capacity 25 (Others have 125). NB Cambodia 561 in Class 34 has the same anomalies.


Unit Class 34 – Heavy Amphibian

Poland 417 & 703 – apart from having different AP ammo (5 & 25), these are statistically equal.

Indonesia 51 has different stats from all other PTS-Ms.

LVTP-7 - Thailand 60 is Size 7, all others Size 6. Same unit has FC 1, all others 0.

Spain 187 has Speed/Swim Speed 24/6, all others are 21/5.

Survivability is mixed. USA 183, S.Korea 182, Spain 187 & Thailand 60 have 5, The remainder (USMC 183, Italy 207 & 208, Green 239, Argentina 237, Brazil 238) have 4.

Spain 187, Italy 207 & 208 have Crew 3, all others are Crew 4.

Lift Capacity varies from 121 to 126. The only one with the standard loadout (125) is Italy 207.

Weights for Italy 207 & 208 are 23 & 24 (different models) respectively. Others are Weight 99-101 (basically non-carryable which, when a vehicle can go just about anywhere, seems logical).

LVTP-5 (USA 182, USMC 182, Taiwan 182, ARVN 108, Spain 186, Italy 206, Green 238, Chile 238, Nigeria 214, S.Yemen 222, N.Yemen 223) have varying Size, Crew, Speed and Swim Speed. The USA model appears to be the standard, and its stats are followed by the ARVN and Italy. Again, the Italian version has a carryable Weight (25) – what is it with these guys?  Should either Yemen have them at all? SIPRI (not infallible, but a decent guideline) has no record of a transfer, and I have the full database from 1950 to 2010.

Spain 186 has Carry 136 and Survivability 5, all others have 134 & 4.

Italy 206 & Spain 186 have HEAT TF 4, all others have 3 except for ARVN 108, which has no HEAT armour at all.

AAV7A1 - Argentina 238 has FC 0, all others 1. It also has sabot ammo (should be HEAT).

Brazil 239 & Greece 9 have Rate of Fire 9, all others have 8 (same weapon). This may be a consequence of having swapped Weapons 1 & 2. Same applies to USMC 690 & 691.

CAMANF - Green 236 & Nigeria 215 have Speed 24, Swim Speed 5, others have 18/4 except Uruguay 581, which has 12/5. I believe 24/5 are the correct values, so the ‘odd men out’ are Brazil, Chile, Ecuador and El Salvador (Unit 236 in all cases)..

Lift Capacity for El Salvador 236 and Uruguay 581 is 25, 125 in all others. Survivability is mixed :4 for Chile, Ecuador and El Salvador, 0 for the other 4.

DUKWs – Uruguay 580 has Speed/Swim Speed 12/5, all others have 17/3. Survivability 4 except for S.Korea 180, Canada 255, Spain 184 and Uruguay 580 (all 0). Lift Capacity 25 for France 435, UK 292, Australia 268, S.Korea 180, Taiwan 180, Canada 255, Indonesia 54 & Uruguay 580, 125 for the others (a slight majority).
Canada 255 has 2 Smoke, others 0.
UK 292, Australia 268 & Canada 255 have Rate of Fire 6, others 9.
Indonesia 54 is the only unarmed DUKW.

EFV. USMC 189 & Italy 209 only, but their stats differ considerably. USMC looks correct – cut & paste job?

K61 – Indonesia 50 has Crew 2, all others 3, and has different armour stats from all others (IIRC it’s actually unarmoured, but that may make it too vulnerable?). Croatia 541 & Indonesia 50 have Lift Capacity 250, others 150.

LVT 4 – Both afvdb and www.wwiivehicles.com have Crew 3, + 30 passengers. In game, crew range from 3 to 6, lift capacity from 24 to 130, and swim speeds from 4 to 6. Land speed is either 13 or 16. Authorities differ on land speed, giving either 32 kph (11) or 40 kph (13). Swim speed is generally quoted as 11-12 kph (4). To save time & space, rather than give individual stats I’ll just add the list of affected units:-
France 437; UK 295; USA 180; USMC 180; Australia 270; S.Korea 181; Taiwan 181; ARVN 107; Netherlands 325; Canada 256; Spain 185; Italy 205; Green 237; Argentina 236; Brazil 237; Thailand 59; Cambodia 560 & 562 (one of these is called ‘Nampo’, but it appears to be the same animal with revised armament); Chile 237; Nigeria 213; S.Yemen 221; N.Yemen 221; Ecuador 237.
Spain 185 has Rangefinder and FC of 1, all others 0.
Canada 256 & Italy 205 have 2 Smoke, all others 0.
UK 295, Australia 270 and Canada 256 have RoF 6, all others 9.
S.Korea 181, Taiwan 181, ARVN 107 and Cambodia 560 have Weapons 3 & 4 without ammunition.
Steel Armour – 2/1/1/2/1/1/0 appears to be standard, but only France 437, UK 295, Australia 270, Canada 256, S.Yemen 221, N.Yemen 221 and Ecuador 237 have this configuration.
HEAT Armour – UK 295, USA 180, Australia 270, S.Korea 181, Taiwan 181, ARVN 107, Canada 256, Thailand 59 and Cambodia 560 do not have it, the others do, but they are not all configured equally.
USMC has Icons 3344/5/6, all others have 242.

Richard H

[Richard_H]

LVT(A) 4 – Land speed ranges from 13 to 15. I believe 13 is correct so this affects France 436 (which also has Swim Speed 5, all others 4), USA 179, USMC 179 and Indonesia 49. Again, USA 179 has Lift Capacity 0, all others 13.
FC ranges from 0 to 2. As LVT(A) 1 has FC 2, suggest same applies to this model. Affects France 436, USA 179 & Australia 271, and same comments apply to Rangefinder – see above.
USMC 179 and Indonesia 49 have Weapon 1 Ammo 100, others (France, USA, Australia) 60. I believe 100 is correct. Same countries have different armour stats from the other 3.

LVTH-6 – USA 176 has Rangefinder 2, USMC 176 has 3.

Type 60 – China 472 has Rangefinder 1, NVA 3 has 2.

Type 63 – NVA 4 has Speed/Swim Speed 23/5, others have 22/4.
N.Korea 4 has Survivability 4, all others 3.
China 473 has RoF 6, all others 7.
Albania 3 and Zimbabwe 205 have RF 5, others 2.
NVA 4 and Albania 3 have 47 main gun rounds, others (China, N.Korea, Zimbabwe) have 45.
NVA 4 has different armour stats from all others.

PT-76B – E.Germany 3 has Stabiliser 0, all others 2.

PT-76 – Finland 3 has Carry Capacity 9, all others 6.
China 471 has Rangefinder 1, all others 5.
China 471 & N.Korea 2 have HEAT Turret armour 6/2/2/1, all others have 6/3/3/2.

Richard H