Remove Curses and Horror Marks?

Zogundar · #1 December 12th, 2007, 06:58 PM

I've been playing the demo lately and I find this game quite intriguing, but one thing I read today does not sit with me well at all. According to the FAQ at strategywiki.org, Curses and Horror Marks are permanent and cannot be removed by any means.
Permanent, irreparable "damage" is a pet peeve of mine in games. It just really irritates me.
Therefore before I even consider buying this game, I have to know - can you mod in a spell or effect or item to get rid of them? Or is it hard-"lol you're screwed, deal with it"-coded?

Edi · #2 December 12th, 2007, 07:09 PM

No, you cannot remove them in any way. They are permanent. I do not think there is a spell effect that can remove either one and even if there was, you would need to mod one through trial and error. And spell modding is the most arcane, convoluted aspect of modding.

Curses and horror marks may be annoying, but they are in the end not dealbreakers. Not for me at least, but they may be for you if you indeed feel as strongly about it as your post indicates.

In any case, welcome to the forum and I hope you will buy the game and stay around.

Meglobob · #3 December 12th, 2007, 07:14 PM

Curses and horror marks are no big deal really.

I certainly would not let it put me off buying this great game.

Zogundar · #4 December 12th, 2007, 07:34 PM

..jeez.

I can sort of understand odd game design decisions for something like Battle for Wesnoth with its deterministic combat system since it's a free game and it's made the way it was because the developers like it that way and hey, it's free. That being they case they can easily say "You don't like it, go make your own game!" For a commercial game, however.. it's um, rather odd to not only implement such a frustration, but to actually make it impossible for players to at least modify it. I'll say this, that's quite a hardcore commitment to insisting upon a rule. :O
For me, however, it is indeed a deal breaker. Too bad, the game has (Or rather had; after making the thread I saw the forum FAQ that showed that the devs refuse to budge on this point and therefore won't be changing it) a lot of potential. Maybe for Dominions 4 the developers can be persuaded/dragged kicking and screaming into the present, carebear times where you can save whenever you want at multiple points, you don't lose XP when you die, and there are no insta-death spike pits.

(Oh wait, wrong genre..)
[rant](And a Level 1 spell no less - yeeeeesh! Even 2nd Edition AD&D wasn't THAT broken in its harshness.)[/rant]

*EDIT*

OK, one other avenue before I give up on this game - is it possible to mod the game so that all units, items, beings, events, and anything else that CAUSES these effects are REMOVED? You can't suffer from a permanent disability if it can't be created in the first place..

Mordici · #5 December 12th, 2007, 07:56 PM

I am sorry that curse and horror mark have made you decide to not buy a game that IMO is one of the best strategy games ever made. Curse is annoying but having a character Horror Marked can be rather entertaining. The game has tremendous potential and updates/new mods that come out on a very regular basis keep it very new and exciting.

I do think that it would be cool to have a save game feature, but there is something to be said for not having one. It makes the decisions-making process much more important before you tell the game to run the next turn.

I think the reason many people have come to Dominions is because they are actually sick of the 'Carebear' mentality of many games and want the added challenge of a game that doesnt give you every opportunity to 'fix' any problems your choices may have caused.

Zogundar · #6 December 12th, 2007, 08:04 PM

I don't know if it was changed in a patch, but one thing that really, really left me with a desire to reload was the first time I fiddled around with Alchemy and lost all but a single Astral Pearl. Oops. Forget the end turn button, I just want a "Mulligan" on that!

Other games have special "Iron Man" settings if the player wants to go that route - but it isn't forced on you. It's a shame Dominions doesn't give you a choice - for that, and for the unforgiving nature of some of its status ailments.

Desert_Fox · #7 December 12th, 2007, 08:09 PM

Hey. First, let me say that this game is really super and you should still get it even with curse and horror marks, which I have honestly never found any trouble.

A possible solution is this: mod the horrors into some stupid, weak dude. This way, even if they show up and attack, they will never cause any harm. I think this is a simple enough solution, and it requires only basic mod ability(I would say).

As for curses, I see a couple possible solutions: 1) you could equip a cursed commander unit with a luck granting item, this would not remove the curse but would lessen its effects in an indirect way(does not actually counter the curse, though). 2) use an item, mod, or healing commander to remove the harmful afflictions that a curse increases the chance of getting. This would not elimenate the curse, but it would keep it from causing trouble.

These are just a few I came up with now on the spot.

I hope any of that helps. Don't cheat yourself out of a totally cool game over this issue (I do not think it is that big a deal, but I respect your opinion). In my great length of time playing this game, horrors and curses have never been a problem for me. Anyway, think it over. I am sure there might be even more circumlocutions to these difficulties, by moding if nothing else. I will think some more about it, too.

By the way, welcome to this great forum.

Cya.

vfb · #8 December 12th, 2007, 08:14 PM

You can mod the specific "Curse" and "Horror Mark" spells to cost 30 gems, and be research level 9 in all paths, if you really want to remove them from the game. You can copystat a militia onto all the units that have a horror mark attack. Or you can copystat a militia onto all the horror units. I'm not familiar with item modding but there may be something similar you can do there.

So while it's not possible to mod in a cure for these afflictions, it is possible to prevent them from occurring in the first place, if you really want to.

Personally, I think both curses and horror marking add to the game. "Curse" will make you think of a new use for a thug you've been using to slug it out on the front lines. "Horror Mark" makes you think of a strategy to keep a unit effective day to day, but also able to defend itself against a horror attack. Or for uber items which horror mark, you'll be more likely to use them with a disposable unit instead of putting them on a unit which you don't want to die.

But all units can die in this game anyway, insta-death (or effective insta-death) can occur to any unit. It's not Sim City

.

Zogundar · #9 December 12th, 2007, 08:27 PM

Why only 30 gems? Why not 99999 or 255 or 65k (What was that upper limit..) or, if not a sum greater than the maximum number you can possess, something equal to it. I guess it would crash the game if you tried to make them "Level 10"?

Could you explain the "copystat"? I think I understand the process, (i.e., X-Lord Grand Daemon Prince Cross Bursting Machine Gun Punch now has 2 HP and will die when breathed on) but not how it will ensure that the units that possess the abilities will be totally prevented from using them (Even if it's a 0.0009% chance that they'll live long enough..)

vfb · #10 December 12th, 2007, 09:00 PM

30 gems because it's more than I've ever seen the AI carry, and I'm worried about breaking something by exceeding the carry-able amount.

Horror Marking is scary because it causes scary units to be summoned to attack your commanders.

You can change any unit in the game with a mod like this:

#selectmonster 649
#clear
#copystats 578
#copyspr 578
#descr "This used to be scary but now it is a Bog Beast"
#end

Do that to the lesser horror, horror, and the doom horror (instead of 649) and now horror marking is sadly not what it used to be.