Czech Pandur II armament

[Marek_Tucan]

My apologies I didn't post this earlier

Czech Republic (OOB 37 post 1993) unit Pandur II IFV will be armed with RCWS-30 turret, IE 30mm ATK Mk44 Bushmaster II CG, 7.62mm CMG (most likely FN MAG, haven't found specs anywhere so only assumption) and two Spike-LR ATGM's (additional two for reload).
Also first vehicles are due to arrive by the end of 2007.

Steyr Pandur II


It is stated Czech Republic ordered a total of 18 differnet Pandur variants, but can't find specifically which ones except the IFV, so most likely here it'll be clear once they get into service.


EDIT: Darn it, I somehow forgot to add the number ... The unit in question is unit 258 (I recall even double checking the number while writing the initial post so I most likely thought, when checking for 2nd time, I have already written it :/)

[Shan]

I noticed that in the new OOBs they only got 10 rounds of HE + APFSDS - looks like not very much to me! In general, I noted that Bradleys + Warriors (and maybe some of the BMPs) -in short: vehicles used by the more popular, larger nations, got lots of ammo, while the less-known ones have to do with less instandard OOBs.
Take the Yuguslavian M-80 variant of the BMP - the 30mm version even got no AP ammo at all, and the 20mm version got only 10 HE and 5 AP - whereas a russian BMP-2 got 30 HE and 30 AP/Sabot !!!
I'm just playing a game as Croatia and sadly noticed that this puts me at a severe disadvantage - out of ammo after 2-3 rounds of fighting!!!

Here are the details of the Czech order:
http://www.steyr-ssf.com/html/2armve...icnewspost.php

[Marek_Tucan]

There are large differences in onboard ammo storage - M2 Bradley has 900 rounds, M3 Bradley whooping 1500 rounds, BMP2 has 500 rounds, OTOH Polish Rosomak (Patria AMV) is being listed just with 100 HE and 100 AP, the Pandur II is supposed to have 100+100 loaded and 100+100 for reloads. Don't see problems with that.

[Shan]

You're right, I checked that again, Marek. For the Pandur it looks like 100/100 ready and 100/100 reload rounds is correct - so therefore, for overall gaming fairness I'd say the reload rounds of ALL types of AFVs should be included in the total ammo count and therefore give the Czech PandurII 20 HE and 20 SABOT shots. (obviously an autocannon salvo in WinSPMBT seems to count for 10 shots?)

And in the case of some AFVs (Bradley, Warrior?) it seems that all rounds on-board are included already...

The reasoning behind this: in the case of tanks with auto-loaders, all rounds carried on the vehicle are included anyway, even toough in real life, reloading is quite complicated and in the case of the Kuerassier it requires the tank in this extreme case to withdraw and take cover - all 3 crewmembers are needed for this process, 2 of them outside... in other cases such as T-72 the crew might be able to do it from inside (?), but still it cannot fight...

Otherwise, you'd have to reduce the ammo of tanks such as T-72s to the amount carried in the Autoloader as well--- and I'm sure noone wants that, this would causse an outcry...

[Marcello]

"in other cases such as T-72 the crew might be able to do it from inside"

Definitively yes. Nowhere nearly an headache as the Kurassier. IIRC it should be possible to load the spare rounds in the gun manually if the autoloader breaks down or its ammo supply is exhausted.
Clearly it would be more time consuming but the tank would not be totally defenceless.

[Shan]

Alright - but my main point was: all AFVs should have their total ammo loadout available to keep things balanced. (maybe we should discuss this in as separate thread)

[Mobhack]

Shan said:
Alright - but my main point was: all AFVs should have their total ammo loadout available to keep things balanced. (maybe we should discuss this in as separate thread)

Yes - thread drift is setting in here already. if you think it is worth discussing, then open up a new topic, as this is no longer about pandur 2 really.

Andy