Play by P2P

[Fyron]

With the massive size of combat replays (25 MB, 75 MB...), PBEM with SE5 is a bit inconvenient to do (not to mention impossible with many email providers to use 75 MB email attachments). Thus, the only way to do it is to manually transfer the files, such as via an FTP server.

But, there is a better way, especially for larger numbers of players in a game: Bit Torrent! Some BT clients and trackers use RSS feeds for automation these days. Azureus' embedded tracker, for example, publishes an RSS feed. Thus, all the host has to do is create a torrent for the turn, and all the players will automatically get the savegame files through RSS. It will work much better than the SE4 TCP/IP system (and probably SE5) because the upload bandwidth of the players will be used to help spread the savegame files.

So, the host of the game needs to run Azureus (and enable the embedded tracker). I'd recommend disallowing the "enable external torrents" option.

Each time he processes the turn, he needs to create a torrent of the savegame files (including those pesky combat logs), then "host" the torrent in Azureus. This is a simple process using the built-in torrent creation tool. You create the torrent using the New Torrent wizard in the file menu. Once the torrent is created, open it in Azureus and start it. Then, right click on the torrent and click on "Host" to host it on the embedded tracker.

It would be a good idea for the host to register a free dynamic domain redirection to avoid the hassle of IP numbers (such as dyndns or no-ip).

Torrent file names should be in a standardized format, such as "savegame.turnnumber". For example, you might have turn 34 of the game "lowtech", so you would create the torrent and name it "lowtech.34".

Each player needs to use a Bit Torrent client with an embedded RSS reader. I will use uTorrent for illustration, because I am most familiar with it. To set up automated retrieval of torrented turns:

1) Go into the RSS Downloader configuration (there is a RSS-like button in the toolbar).

2) Add the feed on the Feeds tab. It will be something like:

FyronSE5|http://kazharii.no-ip.com:6969/rss_feed.xml

3) Create a new Favorite for the savegame.

3a) In the Filter box, put the name of the savegame (eg: lowtech).
3b) Put the location of SE5's savegame folder in the Location box.
3c) Choose the appropriate feed (eg: FyronSE5).
3d) Possibly set a label for the favorite in the label box, such as "SE5 Savegames", or maybe the name of the savegame, whatever you like.

4) Go to Releases tab and click "update now". Check if you have the savegame files listed (assuming the game has started already; otherwise wait til the game has started).

5) Watch as new savegame turns are automatically downloaded!

External Links:

Azureus
uTorrent
dyndns
no-ip

[Sivran]

Or perhaps more simply, emule can do the same thing, easier.

Someone only need run an ed2k server (not even necessary really) and publish ed2k links for the savegame file(s). Anyone with emule could then click the link (or copy to clipboard) and emule would take over from there, grabbing the file from as many sources have even a piece of it and dropping it whereever the user specifies, like the \savegame directory, for example.

The torrent I think is actually more complicated.

Caveat: ANY p2p works better with its appropriate ports forwarded. Some users may not be able to do this for various reasons.

[Fyron]

I don't see how running Azureus is any more complicated than emule. It has a tracker page, people can go to it to get the torrents if they don't want to try to set up the RSS reader. For the players, it is literally identical. For the host, it is about equivalent, I think.

[Baron Munchausen]

This will still be a problem for people who don't have broadband. How about we pester MM to reduce the size of combat replay files?

[Fyron]

We did in the chat, and he said he'd contemplate ways of doing so.

[parabolize]

Compressing the cmb files more will help. The cmb file could also be chopped up into individual player files. But even if the cmb files get dropped to 1/10 the size users without broadband are still screwed.

[pujal]

All these ideas for mp floating around yet no one seems to want to host a game using them. Im really eager to try a mp game, but alas, where are they?

I guess ill try your azereus idea, since I use that.

[capnq]

Baron Munchausen said:
This will still be a problem for people who don't have broadband.

I thought the main purpose of torrents was to allow people without broadband to download large files. I couldn't have downloaded the Gold-to-Deluxe patch without it.

[Baron Munchausen]

With files that are not time sensitive this works fine. It doesn't much matter if I get a copy of the "Loose Change" 911 Documentary today or next week. No one is waiting for me to see it and respond. Turn files for an ongoing game is another matter entirely. Even with the ability to resume large files you don't get any faster performance than your modem can produce. 75 megabytes means a minimum of about 4 hours download time (with optimum performance) on a 56k link. With a '1 turn per day' game this might be manageable -- if you don't mind your line being tied up 4 hours a day. But any game moving faster than that is likely to be a problem. Playing multiple '1 turn per day' games is also unlikely to be possible, while it was before with SE IV.

[shinigami]

Simply put, multiplayer is not practical for most people until the filesize comes waaaay down. Hopefully, MM will follow through on what was said about it in the chat.