Bow Balance

[IKerensky]

I read that bow doesnt add strenght of wearer, is it true ?

Because I understand for the XBows, but for the bows, this is unrealistic and seems a bit too much. Especially given the frequent miss and the FF that already plague archery unit.

[Kristoffer O]

This does not matter as long as you do not have archers of different strength. Currenly only longbowmen are stronger and their bows do more dmg as it is.

If we would add str we would give the bows a -2 dmg to compensate. This would not make any difference on the game. Do you believe that bows are too weak in general?

[Targa]

If strength were to be added, the friendly fire issue would kill more of your units.

Do you believe that bows are too weak in general?

I like them the way they are.

Technically though, strength shouldn't make any difference. A bowman would not be a bowman unless he was strong enough to draw the bow back all the way. The bow design is what limits its potential for damage, not the strength of the user. ie: a bow with a 100 lb. pull will do the same amount of damage regardless of the strength of its wielder, as long as he is capable of drawing it back fully.

[IKerensky]

Well I have decent result with long bow... except against armored unit wich is somewhat weird... because historically longbow where the Knights killer not the too slow crossbow...

Things that could help is to add a chance to hit the horse

Bow weakness strike me when I compared the composite, long and current bow. then I look at a basic shortsword and saw his damage range to be from 5 + 10 strengh = 15 + 2D6* so they are basically better than any bow.... wich is somewhat surprising ....

What also is annoying is that bow already are weakened by their great miss rate at medium/long range so it seems balancing enough.

Also keep in mind that bow user strength DID greatly affect the weapon damage capability.

[Bowlingballhead]

Bowmen are almost universally cheap, however. I have discovered, through playing around with Caelum, that bowmen are rather effective in larger hordes. Since you can buy ten times the bowmen you can any powerful melee unit, this is quite possible. Their inaccuracy does make them difficult to mix with melee units, which is a shame.

In my modding experiments I also discovered that morale checks are caused merely by being shot AT, not just by being hit. Fire enough arrows, and you can send low-morale units fleeing without a single arrow hitting its mark. This became clear because my multilaunchers (deliberately) can't hit the broad side of a barn.

[Taqwus]

Massed bowmen in back; cheap or tough units in front. When playing T'ien Chi, for instance, early on I used masses of cheap and ethereal Dispossed Spirits to stall enemies and had my bowmen fire volley after volley into the melee. Works even better with Wind Guide, and while Flaming Arrows will hurt your chaff too, chaff's meant to be cheap.

[Argitoth]

Originally posted by Taqwus:
Massed bowmen in back; cheap or tough units in front. When playing T'ien Chi, for instance, early on I used masses of cheap and ethereal Dispossed Spirits to stall enemies and had my bowmen fire volley after volley into the melee. Works even better with Wind Guide, and while Flaming Arrows will hurt your chaff too, chaff's meant to be cheap.

One time I casted Wind Guide and Fire Arrows on 100 animated archers (which already do massive damage) and about 50 more regular shortbow archers. I kill huge ranks with one round. It was too sweet.

[Gandalf Parker]

there is one bow that does. The "thunder bow" I think it is. I like to give it, and the crystal eye thing, and a BUNCH of strength boosters to the summonable giant when I need a god-killer

[Taqwus]

Yeah. The Firbolg (Awaken Sleeper; Nature / probably Conjuration, but check...), with 15 precision and otherwise good stats makes a good archer.
Another missile weapon for which strength is useful is the Fire Bola; it's a thrown weapon, and strength affects range. Lots of ammo, too, and it takes only one hand slot.

[Kristoffer O]

Originally posted by IKerensky:

Bow weakness strike me when I compared the composite, long and current bow. then I look at a basic shortsword and saw his damage range to be from 5 + 10 strengh = 15 + 2D6* so they are basically better than any bow.... wich is somewhat surprising ....

I would prefer to be impaled by a thin arrow to being impaled or cut by a short sword. To my knowledge the romans were considered ignoble when they started to use short swords instead of long spears because the casualties were so much higher . Battles were no longer fun so to speak.