AIC Mod in finite vs. infinite resource settings

[Yimboli]

I griped a while ago about how high maintenance costs were in AIC, and how it was killing my economy (literally, 20 warships - 10 frigates, 10 destroyers - were enough to set my income to the negative). This game was with infinite resources. I quit that game cuz i got sick of it. I started a new one on finite resources, and notice that the maintenance costs are MUUUCCHHH lower. Has anyone else noticed this? what is the logic behind this? i don't mean the obvious answer that infinite resource games have more resources... that much i realize. but the damper that maintenance put on my economy rendered my first AIC game (infinite resources) unplayable, while my finite resources game I have going now is nowhere near as bad. why?

-Tim

[ May 13, 2004, 20:14: Message edited by: Yimboli ]

[Yimboli]

nevermind. i just made my first attack ship, and maintenance was over 1000 minerals. this is practically unplayable... thus, I guess I shall stop playing AIC.

[ June 08, 2004, 15:23: Message edited by: Yimboli ]

[QBrigid]

I am sorry that AIC is not for you and that you do not think a level 3 AIC Destroyer should cost 1000. Your AIC home world alone gives you about 15000 minerals and with mineral extraction right from the start and you should be able to get another destroyer or more then several smaller combat missile ships for every 2 or three Mining Facilities as long as you develope your Planets then your economy will develope and then you can aford a large fleet.

I like this about AIC there is a great deal that goes into infurstruture first but I can see how this can be frustrating. You really should play TDM it is a MOD with just a very basic economy and the AI is up to date.

I would like to say this. I just built a level two Destroyer in se4 with the STOCK Abidon. With only 2 level III Shields and Emisive Armors both at level 2 and 2 Phychic Projecters with lvl 2 Combat Sensor and ECM and it cost 1600 maintenance EACH, thats about 500 more maintenance then AIC.

Tim what do you think a Destroyers maintenance cost should be?

[ May 14, 2004, 12:28: Message edited by: QBrigid ]

[oleg]

Originally posted by QBrigid:

quote:

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Originally posted by oleg:
Pick up MP* option for the empire. That will give you better mining facilities. And ship more people around to build cities faster !!!

I sometimes have the problem with maintenance but only if my home system is poor.

Great post Oleg, wish I thought of posting this.

---

Thanks

Another idea - if maintanence is such a problem, lower default value in settings.txt from 100% to 90 or 80. That should cure it It won't be the same AIC mod, but what a heck, it is YOUR game

As to finite resources, don't play it untill you master infinite. Even then, always chose Religious and build Nature Shrine III ASAP.

[Grand Lord Vito]

Originally posted by oleg:
Another idea - if maintanence is such a problem, lower default value in settings.txt from 100% to 90 or 80. That should cure it It won't be the same AIC mod, but what a heck, it is YOUR game

As to finite resources, don't play it untill you master infinite. Even then, always chose Religious and build Nature Shrine III ASAP.

You probably shouldnt mess with the settings file to much if you lower the maintenance settings below 90% you will probably break all the Crystalline Races and after you upgrade to the Last engineering section component or build the Systems Maintenance Facility for all players you will probably end up with negitive maintence numbers in a lot of of places and break the game whole game.
AIC maintenance percentages are very complexed and I know Alneyan and JLS put a lot of thought into the Race Maintenance Characteristic option.
It is better to master infinite resource games before you satart a finite game.
When playing a FINITE AIC game Citys and LARGE Cities are extremely important and you will always run out of RADS energy first, followed by Minerals. The food useually Last for ever. The AIC AI will not melt down for a long time (if ever) so be on your guard.

Oleg is right on with MP* multiplayer game option = Increased Research and resource facilities for a faster Multiplayer build up and expantion.

Most of us also learn and play at higher AI bonus levels in our solo games.
O1* (starting option one)RECOMENDED FOR NEW PLAYERS that gives JUST you a larger home world and Colonys = more EVERYTHING including research and intel.

02* (starting option 2) RECOMENDED FOR NEW PLAYERS this gives JUST you 150% more Resources, this will boost anybodys economy enough to take even the best placed AI Player. (O2* option is not recommended for Finite games because it wastes your resources faster then you can use or store them)

HINT what ever start option (even none of the above) you play you can have tons of smaller missile ships and out match the AI (fleet to fleet) most of the time early in the game even without building one mineral facility if that is your only goal
I fo i remeber correctly only the hive AI race to destroyers and light cruisers early in a LOW AI bonus game.

I hope this helps.
GLV

[ May 14, 2004, 16:41: Message edited by: Grand Lord Vito ]

[oleg]

Originally posted by Grand Lord Vito:
You probably shouldnt mess with the settings file to much if you lower the maintenance settings below 90% you will probably break all the Crystalline Races and after you upgrade to the Last engineering section component or build the Systems Maintenance Facility for all players you will probably end up with negitive maintence numbers in a lot of of places and break the game whole game.

GLV

Sure, but if he is really desperate...
90% instead of 100% should almost half the maintanence if I am not mistaken.

[oleg]

Originally posted by Grand Lord Vito:
HINT what ever start option (even none of the above) you play you can have tons of smaller missile ships and out match the AI (fleet to fleet) most of the time early in the game even without building one mineral facility if that is your only goal
I fo i remeber correctly only the hive AI race to destroyers and light cruisers early in a LOW AI bonus game.

I hope this helps.
GLV

Not so. many AIs like to use fighters en mass and research them quickly. Small ships with missiles can not have much of PD and will be chewed up with small if any damage to enemy. Well, it normally happens to my ships

[Grand Lord Vito]

Sure. But taking o1 and o2 start options in the game will almost double your resources and research.

We dont need to HARD change the setting file and take a chance on breaking the mod. And you still have the resources to have more ships then a 10% hard maintanence reducion change will give you


Sorry about the Last post " of of places and break the game whole game"
(Wow I even slur my typing after a few cocktails)

[ May 14, 2004, 17:20: Message edited by: Grand Lord Vito ]

[Grand Lord Vito]

Originally posted by oleg:
many AIs like to use fighters en mass and research them quickly. Small ships with missiles can not have much of PD and will be chewed up with small if any damage to enemy. Well, it normally happens to my ships

A few low cost escorts with point defence will remedy this. Unless you are talking about taking out an AI Players home world or large colony early, then ye I would research fighters like the AI did and launch them on small transports. Nevermind that is not enough, it takes a lot to glass the AI home world.
But it will help at early warp point defences

When playing against the AI at low AI bonus I can easily out research all of them (maybe not the eee but they tend to be freindly) even when i dont take any start options I usually win.

[ May 14, 2004, 17:23: Message edited by: Grand Lord Vito ]

[gregebowman]

It's been awhile since I"ve played teh AIC mod, but when I'm running low on resources in other mods, I suddenly increase my research on extraction and storage, followed by whatever it is that you need to get the 10% bonus to production. Then, if I'm really low or in the negative balance, I either mothball ships or scrap old ones. Then once things pick up, I'll take the ships out of mothball status.

[ May 14, 2004, 18:15: Message edited by: gregebowman ]