Question: Infantry getting slaughtered inside their APC by small-arms fire

[arkhangelsk]

According to the instructions, if I load infantry onto say a tank, they are presumed to be riding on top and I can expect to lose them if the tank gets sprayed by small-arms fire. If I use a proper APC, I am supposed to be able to avoid this.

Today, however, I found out it was possible for it to happen to my motorized infantrymen riding inside a BMP-2(-). It brushed past some Japanese infantry at one hex. Their antitank weapons didn't work so the BMP was fine, but somehow my entire squad was annihilated.

To be fair, so far I hadn't seen it happen to say BMP-2s under artillery fire or when they are shot at on greater distances.

Is this a new Version 7 feature?

[DRG]

...... NO it's not some "new Feature"

So how about we go back to the beginning and you provide some actual information that I can use to investigate this

1/ WHICH nations "infantrymen" riding in WHICH BMP-2(-) ??
2/ YEAR ??( and month might be helpful )
3/ Is animation ON in your preferences and if yes, what level is it set to ?
4/ Were the Japanese infantry in the same or an adjacent hex ?

You watched this happen.. did you think to make a save game so we could at least watch the replay ?

It IS possible that, depending on what else is going on in the hex (clutter, wreaks etc ) what animation level you are set to and how fast your computer can process and display information that after the antitank weapons didn't work your squad dismounted only to be killed immediatly by close in small arms fire and you blinked and missed it but if you don't provide all the information and a save game we're just guessing unless we get the information and maybe the save game and can test for ourselves

Don

[Mobhack]

You were assaulted by the Japanese infantry that you "brushed past at 1 hex", i.e. at infantry assault range of 1 hex or less.

Infantry A/T Assault is NOT just firing - it can involve the defending passengers in a melee around the carrier vehicle. So yes, they can be killed separately from the carrier vehicle (or survive while the carrier does not).

This is "Steel Panthers 101" basic stuff.

Andy

[DRG]

..yes but we will test anyway once I get some more information........



Don

[arkhangelsk]

I have been trying to stick the savefile on before, but the forum wasn't working great back then ... it is attached now.

It was September 1979, Russia v Japan. Note the vehicle J5 [BMP-2(-)], who was carrying J0. It got attacked as it blew past a Japanese Mech Section at 76,48. A 90mm Recoilless also took potshots. Seeing that J5 wasn't damaged or even badly suppressed, I got a tank to help and fired the autocannon and cannon a few times until the 90mm was destroyed and Japanese Mech section retreated to 75,48 (its present location). So I thought it is safe to unload my infantry - that was when I realized that my J0 was wiped out.

Animation and Delay levels were at max. I think I saw a certain line blink past, but I didn't really catch it because I didn't exactly expect my infantry to be annihilated by an attack which didn't even damage the APC.

ADDENDUM: After attaching the save, I just tried to switch players to Japan, let the computer finish my Russian turn and watch the replay, but I couldn't catch the text showing the demise of my J0 squad this time either.

All I was able to find out is that the killer of my J0 was apparently unit AJ2 on Japan's side - it now has a kill mark to its credit and I didn't let the Japanese kill any of my squads, tanks or BMPs up till now.

Hope the above helps the investigation.

[DRG]

I tested this from the info you first supplied and "guessed a bit " for time period

There is no real "bug" but you aren't being show the full sequence of events.

I can recreate this over and over........ if the close assault is only partially successful and some survivors remain the infantry icon for the survivors is shown and they ( usually ) pull back

If the close assault results in total destruction of the defending infantry squad you are NOT shown the infantry Icon so it APPEARS they are being killed in their vehicle . This is more clear if after the assault/mêlée there are defending survivors... those now "appear" and retreat but the infantry are not placed outside the carrier if they don't survive the close initial assault mêlée ( for obvious reasons... ) which LOOKS like they are killed inside ( which they could be....... gunned down coming out the door/ramp )


Make sense ?


Don

[arkhangelsk]

That explains things. Thanks.