Immortals

[GrudgeBringer]

I have a short question that I thought I knew the answer to. However, I have never had an immortal pretender and thought I would make sure.

When your immortal is killed and reappears in your capitol, does he lose his equipment?

[Verjigorm]

Yes, he does.

When using him for defensive purposes, don't take anything expensive. Usually, you just want to take a few choice gems and drop as much death as you can before he dies.

Now, the Lich pretender is VERY resilient and, especially deep in his dominion, can act as a good thug. Cheap equipment is very nice on him.

Master Lich is definitely a no-no... He dies from arrow volleys. Not that he can't wear stuff, just make sure he's got guards.
Phoenix can't wear anything anyway.
Vampire Queen? I think she moved to Mexico after Dominions 2...
Lich is built for thugging especially in deep dominion.

[Peter Ebbesen]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

Master Lich is definitely a no-no... He dies from arrow volleys. Not that he can't wear stuff, just make sure he's got guards.

He doesn't die (much) from arrow volleys if he has air shield and etherealness from items, but you are right.. he is terribly frail.

That makes him bad for offensive cloud trapeze/teleport operations in friendly dominion, but he is still excellent for suicide-defense, where he is guaranteed to cast at least one spell - so long as he has the magic to cast a spell that counts.

In the very late game, a master lich who has wished for power is one of the most terrifying pretenders for suicide-defense, outclassing even a normal lich (or for Ermor, the lich queen) due to the extra miscellaneous slot and more magic - but admittedly that is the very late game and 100 astral gems that could have been used for, oh, a Chayot.

Still, with the huge amounts of magic a master lich is normally created with, having used a wish to make him actually able to survive in battle, he is capable of laying down a wide variety of high-powered spells while surviving. I am not saying that this is always a good idea as it is so damn expensive, but if one has made a master lich for the magical variety that is also capable of casting wish (which it will be even if it only has a base 5 astral by wearing RoS+RoW+SS+CC), one should at least consider it if one is being pressed on the defensive. Soul Drain + Phoenix Pyre + Invulnerability + battlefield wide spells + cheap equipment is a very, very, fun combination on an immortal.

[SciencePro]

Just be careful not to let him get killed while retreating. That kills him for real.

You also have to watch out for charm if he is a regular commander but that's not a problem with a pretender.

[Verjigorm]

Originally Posted by SciencePro

Just be careful not to let him get killed while retreating. That kills him for real.

You also have to watch out for charm if he is a regular commander but that's not a problem with a pretender.

Retreating: An Immortal will never retreat inside friendly dominion even when the "army routed" message is displayed, so generally, any time you would be retreating, you would be in an enemy dominion which is usually not where you want your immortal pretender to be especially if he's got globals on him.

Charming: I assume you're talking about the lovely Enchantment summon, the Demilich here? I doubt that anyone would wish for a Master Lich, Phoenix, Vampire Queen or Lich... They wouldn't be worth the gems.

[SciencePro]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

Retreating: An Immortal will never retreat inside friendly dominion even when the "army routed" message is displayed,

really? I'm pretty certain I lost some vampire lords in friendly dominion that way. And regular vampires retreat all the time inside friendly dominion. Maybe it's just pretenders that have that protection?

[Psycho]

They may retreat if subjected to fear effect, but otherwise won't (in friendly dominion).

[Peter Ebbesen]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

Charming: I assume you're talking about the lovely Enchantment summon, the Demilich here? I doubt that anyone would wish for a Master Lich, Phoenix, Vampire Queen or Lich... They wouldn't be worth the gems.

In principle I guess that wishing for a Risen Oracle and investing enough gems in it to be able to cast useful spells might be viable for some weird plans in some very big or long games, though the gem cost is enough to scare me.

Somewhat cheaper, wishing for some of the nation-specific immortal national heroes that come with a good dose of base magic (T'ien C'hi, Sauromatia, LA Ulm, and more) could make sense in some circumstances since immortals capable of suicide defense/offense in one's own dominion every turn can be very valuable... but even thinking of doing so begs the question: "Are you sure a non-Immortal Chayot wouldn't serve your goals better?"