What to do?

[hveldenz]

Question to the collective. I had a recent battle in my German 1941 long campaign (core around 5K now) where in a meeting engagement the Brits has 8(eight) troops of OB 25 pounders and 4(four) troops of 4.5" OB guns! They also had the usual slew of mortars.

I'll be honest - I punted back out to the prior battle save - I was getting way too killed by the overkill arty - (approx 2300-2400 of their points!).

Weakness I admit.

However, What should I do tactically if I run into that again? I expect potential repeats of that when I return to Russia in 1942. Do I just run like hell? I hate to end a campaign with a developed core on one bad AI deployment. I can't imagine getting to 1944 with a bigger force and possibly facing 5000-6000 points of American OB artillery, probably with 5-6 flights of P-38js to boot.

Thanks

[DRG]

Much the same thing happened to me 10 years ago with SP1. I had built up a lovely armoured force over the length of the campaign and January 1945 rolled around I was swarmed with US airstrikes and no matter how many times I saved and replayed I got creamed and all my hard fought panzers and crews were decimated. C'est Le Guerre.

That's the way it goes sometimes. The game is not set up so everyone could methodically advance and beat the AI over and over. Once in awhile it will through a curve at you and no matter what army every once in awhile the enemy is stronger. You STILL have the advantage of using FOO's and priority hexes over the AI.

Too bad you didn't include a save. I would have liked to see this AI purchace

Don

[wulfir]

hveldenz said:
I hate to end a campaign with a developed core on one bad AI deployment.

hveldenz,

If you like, I can buy/rebuy and deploy the AI forces for your campaign - make it thougher/easier/add a twist or two..., whatever you like...

[hveldenz]

To Don,

I do understand C'est le Guerre I guess. I wish I had the save, just to see the rest of the deployment. I do enjoy the AI - it is the best so far of the SP1,SP2,SP3,SPWaW, and WinSPMBT series to date IMHO.

To both wulfir and Don, thanks for your responses. I realize I do have FOOs and priority points. I was wondering if anyone has any tactical/operational advice if/when I encounter a very heavy OB artilley AI again. I probably will not bail out next time, but take my lumps (if multiple replys, like Don said.)

Do I have to be really mobile(more than normal)? It still smoked my mortar sections and got to my infantry. My two batteries dedicated to CB work do not fire every time, and the 25#ers have a max range greater than my 10.5cms.

Does a larger map help for the future? I remember some 20x30 maps in WinSPMBT (I know - there are differences) where the small map made artillery VERY lethal.

I play routinely on 80x80. Is this too small for a long campaign a year in with now 5500 or so core points on my side?

Thanks for the input.

[Mobhack]

Try looking at this thread in the forum.

Cheers
Andy

[hveldenz]

Andy,

Thanks - I had seen that thread, that is why I have a 17cm in my core. I also have a 21cm hvy art in my core (why - it seemed like fun at the beginning ) Both of these units are elite with 100+ experience. They still only CB around 40% of the time in response to enemy OB fire. I also only have two batteries, and the case I asked about included 12 enemy OB batteries. My batteries do do CB ( and the 21cm is great when it connects!) What should my on board forces do/try once I encounter a heavy OB set in the AI?

[Mobhack]

What should my on board forces do/try once I encounter a heavy OB set in the AI?

Do not fire your experienced counter batteries - leave them silent to fire CB. CB is a rarity (or off map arty would simply shut down on turn 2 or so!). If a real problem, more counter battery candidates means more chance of CB fires. Buy another bty or so in the early core. do not buy over expensive 17cm type arty - use relatively cheap but longish ranged stuff (e.g. the 10cm K18 if you are playing Nazi). Use the on-map arty (SP mortars etc) to deal with enemy on-map troops while the experienced core off map does the CB task. (Better yet, use an army whose basic gun-howitzer has a relatively good range like the UK . Investigate the captured arty batteries, as these often have better performance than the standard Nazi ones - e.g. if playing German I usually wait till 1941 when I can use captured 25 pounders (unit 313) or unit 317 (captured 5.5 inch) or #330 (Some French piece). Unit #319 you have to wait till 42 for - best to use 5.5 inch.

If you need to stay in one place, make sure you are dug in (or in shell holes, rough, woods, broken buildings etc). Hint - fire your large-calibre arty to make nice shell holes around an objective cluster, for your troops (hopefully!) to use as shell scrape cover after taking them.

Don't give the enemy targets, other than some sacrificial ones as arty attractors. Try buying some support mortars or howitzers and perhaps SP mortars - and keep these continuously firing on the approach routes etc. Once he locates the decoy arty and starts firing, you may get CB on his off map (at least they are not firing at your manoeuvre troops!), and locations on his on board arty units which you can now deal with.


Cheers
Andy

[PatG]

All good suggestions so far but I think the real problem is that there is no way to know in advance how much arty the other side has bought.

You get a meeting engagement, buy your forces appropriately, do your set up, maybe a turn or two of advance and - bang - the HE hurricane starts. What do you do then?

Since the opposition is artillery heavy you should have an advantage in numbers. The key would be to get onto (and off of) the objectives as efficiently as possible and nullify the artillery advantage. For infantry, scout out the enemies sight lines and move up under cover. For armour, go all out hopefully moving forward faster than the enemy can replot his fires.

In both cases, use scouts to grab VHs and pull the enemy out of position to be chewed up piecemeal. Assault through the objectives and defend from the far side to stay away from probable gold spots and to force the enemy to come to you.

Just a couple of thoughts.