British Mech infantry Service Dates and vehicles

[Mobhack]

You will not have the new patch yet. Check Mobhack, formation No. 2 - start date in the new patch will be 1/42.

Andy

[chuckfourth]

OOPs sorry got my dates mixed up Sorry for the inconvienience.

[blitzkreig]

I've recently been reading an interesting book - "Dunkirk: Fight to the Last Man" - which highlighted some points regarding the UK OOB07 in 1939-1940 during the battle of France.

Chuckforth asked if there was any evidence that formation 330 (Mech Patrol) existed. The book includes several often amazing accounts on the activiites of British carriers in the Battle of France. One Lt Furness of the Welsh Guards won a VC in a carrier action in the retreat from Arras(Chp 14, p183-187). Lt Furness led 4 carriers and a light tank against several German MG postions which were covering the main escape route for the bn's soft skinned vehicles. Lt Furness' charge led to several MG postions being silenceced in order to allow the MT convoy to escape. The carrieres came under heavy small arms, MG & anti-tank fire but surprised the enemy by charging straight into their postions. The fighting was so fierce that Lt Furness was seen leaning out of his carreri fighting hand to hand with a German soldier who he eventually managed to dispatch with his revoler.

"of the ten men whose carriers took on the Germans four were killed, five wounded or taken prisernor"

Never the less his attack bought enough time for the convoy to escape.

Gameplay points:

1. The book indicates each (Lorried) Infantry Bn seems to have had a single carrier plt used for recon and many other tasks. They were armed with a mixture of Bren LMG, Rifles, grenades and anti-tank rifles with a dismounted capability that fits with Formation 330 (Uk Mech Patrol).

2. Not sure about the accuracy of the Mech Patrol dismounts weapons though. There wasn't a single refence to British use of issued SMGs. The Sten MK 1 didn't come into service until 1941 according to Jane's Gun Recognition Guide and I've never heard of a Lanchester SMG.


Sources:

Dunkirk: Fight to the Last Man by H. Sebag-Montefire published by Peguin ISBN -13:978-0-670-91082-3
ISBN-10: 0-670-91082-1

Jane's Gun Recognition Guide by I. Hogg (2nd ed), published by Harper Collins ISBN 0 00 472453 4

[thatguy96]

Information on the Lanchaster can be found here: http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg84-e.htm

[DRG]

I'll look into it

Don

[blitzkreig]

thatguy96 - Cheers, a good link, you learn something new every day! Mainly issued to the RN eh?, properly why I've never heard of it! Looks like a strait copy of a German weapon!

Don - After further reading I had another dig around on Britsh units 1939-1940. I'm not sure if this should be a "new" post or another thread but I'll put it here. I had a look in OOB7 1940 and compared it to stuff from the book I mentioned earlier and the bayonet strength website and noticed that most of the BEF was made up of (Lorried) Inf Divs with the exception of 1 UK Armd Div operating further south. I picked up on the following:

1. (Lorried) Inf Bn had

HQ Coy - various parts but important in game terms Pioneer plt, carrier recce plt & mortar plt.

4 x Rifle Coys.

This surprised me, I thought the 4th Coy had been a support Coy for ever but it seems to have evolved after the Dunkirk debacle. Not sure if it's justifed to have a new formation along the lines of "lorried inf Bn HQ Coy" to replace formation 016 until later 1940? I was also very surprised that there was no reference to a Bn having any Vickers MMGs, you'd think they would have had a few wouldn't you? But pherhaps not.

The down side to any change would be making the British players life even more difficult by losing all those extra carriers and anti-tank weapons in formation 016, but then life was hard for the BEF who were underequiped compared to their German counterparts. I have no idea whether this effects the Motor Inf formations based around the Rifle Brigade during this period formation 013.

Sources:

Dunkirk: Fight to the last Man by H. Sebag-Montefiore, published by Penguin. ISBN:0-670-91082-1

www.bayonetstrength.com (Not that well sourced)