Possible Bug?

[Master Belisarius]

Suicide_junkie:
Really I would like to be wrong!
Please, can you do a test for me?

1) If you have the TDM and 1.49 installed, start a game with 2000 points and random AIs, until one of the random AI's is the Pyrochette or the Aquilaeian.

Edit: you also need to set the Computer Player Difficulty to High, if not, probably the random AI's will not use all the possible points.

2) Change the Pyrochette or Aquilaeian to human control and save this (or these) empires.
3) Start a new game, but using the previously saved *.emp file. You will see that they're not using all the available points.
4) Start a gain, but create the *.emp file yourself, using the AI_general.txt for the empire that you're testing, as reference (and of course for 2000 points).
5) Please check if using manually the data included into the AI_general.txt, the result is over the 2000 points.
6) If you can see what I did wrong, please, please, let me know.

[This message has been edited by Master Belisarius (edited 03 November 2001).]

[Suicide Junkie]

quote:

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If you can see what I did wrong, please, please, let me know.

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So far my theory is this:
1) SE4 adds advanced racial traits from the general.txt
- if the total racial points remaining would go below zero, don't add it, and quit. If the points remaining is 0 add the trait and quit.

2) Racial Characteristics are added & subtracted.

What you were intending to do was take racial points purchased in step two, and buy advanced traits in step one.

But, since step two hadn't occurred yet, you didn't have the points available and were denied the trait.

[Master Belisarius]

quote:

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Originally posted by suicide_junkie:
What you were intending to do was take racial points purchased in step two, and buy advanced traits in step one.
But, since step two hadn't occurred yet, you didn't have the points available and were denied the trait.

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Ok, I like your theory. But still we have a bug, right? (Or the manual empire creation must be more restrictive, or the AI random generator have a bug).

[Suicide Junkie]

What the AI generator has to do is set all of the characteristics first, so you can have those points available for advanced traits.
The other option is to just ignore the racial point limit, either allowing the AI to choose every trait if its programmed that way, or only produce an error at the end, "This race used too many racial points, and was not added".

[capnq]

In two more test games, I used Add Existing Empire, then Edit to look at the settings. In both cases, the race had only used 2000 of the 5000 starting points. This was with the Sergetti and Fazrah.

I also notice that the General_AI files always list the Advanced Characteristics Last under each option.

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Cap'n Q
My first SE IV mod! Hypermaze quadrant
The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the
human mind to correlate all of its contents. We live on a placid
island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was
not meant that we should go far. -- HP Lovecraft, "The Call of Cthulhu"

[This message has been edited by capnq (edited 03 November 2001).]

[This message has been edited by capnq (edited 03 November 2001).]

[DirectorTsaarx]

quote:

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Originally posted by capnq:
In two more test games, I used Add Existing Empire, then Edit to look at the settings. In both cases, the race had only used 2000 of the 5000 starting points. This was with the Sergetti and Fazrah.

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Of course. The "Add Existing" using the *.emp files, which were built using a 2000-point setting. If you want to "Add Existing" and have them use 5000 racial points, you have to edit the race to include all the settings. It also helps to save the 5000-point race so you can use it in the future without edits. I'm attaching a Word document that includes the 5000-point settings for all basic SE4 races (the ones that came from MM).

This is why a number of the modpack races come with multiple *.emp files; one for each racial point setting.

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L++ GdY $ Fr>Fr++ C++ SdS T-- Sf Tcp? A%% M- Mp! RTH!P Pw Fq-->Fq+ Nd>Nd+++++ Rp++ G+

[Alpha Kodiak]

I tried out random generation for the new Versions of the Rage and the Vaxin at 2000 points and observed the following:

Vaxin - should be Advanced Storage and Organic, with adjustments to characteristics that reduce the total points enough to allow for both advanced traits. Actual result was Advanced Storage only, but characteristics modified to allow for the Organic.

Rage = should be Propulsion and Advanced Storage with adjustments to characteristics. Actual result was Propulsion and Advanced Storage (using up all points) but no adjustments to characteristics at all.

In both cases, I had moved all of the less-than-100% characteristics to the beginning of the list to allow room for those characteristics that were greater than 100%. I believe that, as SJ said, the advanced characteristics are applied first. If they cost more than the available points, only the first ones that total less than or equal to the available are used. Then, if all the points are used, the general characteristics are not looked at, at all.

[PsychoTechFreak]

BUMP ?