Rules Questions

[Sheap]

I have some questions about game rules (mechanics, not house rules) that aren't answered in the FAQ. This would perhaps be a good candidate for a long running/sticky thread since these sorts of questions come up a lot but they are scattered all over.

1) What exactly does the Ichtyid Net do? I figured it might work like an entanglement spell (like Vine Arrow) but someone else thought it might cause fatigue or paralysis. Does anyone know exactly?

2) What is the exact relationship between Order scale, Unrest and Tax? I know Order/Turmoil affects the results of tax collection (7% per notch, right?) and Unrest also reduces tax collection. But I do not know exactly how Unrest does this. Also, I know Order scale doesn't influence Unrest directly, but I read that it influences the amount of unrest increase/decrease as a result of tax rate. Is that true? If so it could be viewed as influencing unrest directly unless taxes are very high or very low.

3)(Asked in another thread but I am trying to discourage that here ) What exactly are the rules regarding Heart of Winter, Desert Sun and Restless Worshippers? Do they work correctly? They seem to have insignificant effects.

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Sheap:
1) What exactly does the Ichtyid Net do? I figured it might work like an entanglement spell (like Vine Arrow) but someone else thought it might cause fatigue or paralysis. Does anyone know exactly?

It works like vine arrow, tangle vines, webbing, and the wild growth spell.

Also, I know Order scale doesn't influence Unrest directly, but I read that it influences the amount of unrest increase/decrease as a result of tax rate.

The order scale has no effect on unrest whatsoever.

[PvK]

1) AFAIK, like other entanglers, it keeps the target in place and unable to attack (not sure what the effects on spells and defense are) until they break free, which has a chance based on strength of the entangled target of succeeding, but does not cause fatigue in any way.

2) I don't think Order/Turmoil affects unrest - it's its own thing, with its own effects. Both Unrest and Turmoil reduce gold income. I don't have the formulas, but I know they've been posted, and I think the scale effects can all be seen in the modding documentation.

3) I don't think Heart of Winter, Desert Sun and Restless Worshippers have insignificant effects, but they may have effects that are difficult to observe, unless you know what to look for. They may be likely to not be used very effectively without understanding what they do. Winter and Sun increase the chances that the dominion's temperture scale will spread to adjacent provinces even if the enemy dominion is strong there. Restless worshippers increases the strength of preaching attempts by a certain amount, and maybe something else.

PvK

[ June 10, 2004, 19:06: Message edited by: PvK ]

[Ironhawk]

Actually I've been curious about the taxes/unrest interaction as well. Does anyone know what that formula is? Seems like it might be like ~1% of income per 1 unrest?? Would love to know the specifics on this one.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Ironhawk:
Actually I've been curious about the taxes/unrest interaction as well. Does anyone know what that formula is? Seems like it might be like ~1% of income per 1 unrest?? Would love to know the specifics on this one.

Income is halved at 50 unrest by default. It's a moddable parameter (see modding.pdf in the doc folder).

[st.patrik]

Originally posted by Sheap:
2) What is the exact relationship between Order scale, Unrest and Tax? I know Order/Turmoil affects the results of tax collection (7% per notch, right?) and Unrest also reduces tax collection. But I do not know exactly how Unrest does this. Also, I know Order scale doesn't influence Unrest directly, but I read that it influences the amount of unrest increase/decrease as a result of tax rate. Is that true? If so it could be viewed as influencing unrest directly unless taxes are very high or very low.

back in Dom I order reduced unrest and turmoil increased it, and so the benefit of high order was that you could put your taxes to more than 100% without generating unrest. This led to competitive players taxing at 200% in their rich provinces, and patrolling to keep unrest down.

In Dom II order doesn't reduce unrest so much as give you more money for the same taxe rate. I think the devs did this to stop people from taxing so high. Accordingly, high tax kills population as well as increasing unrest (And of course patrolling also kills people) so you are damaging your tax base by setting your taxes high.

[liga]

Originally posted by Sheap:

2) What is the exact relationship between Order scale, Unrest and Tax? I know Order/Turmoil affects the results of tax collection (7% per notch, right?) and Unrest also reduces tax collection. But I do not know exactly how Unrest does this.

there are basic game setting that you can change in a mod (or map)

10.4 #unresthalfinc
The amount of unrest that cuts income in half. Default is 50.

10.5 #unresthalfres
The amount of unrest that cuts resources in half. Default is 100.

... i don't know if it is a proportional things or something more complicated.

I also know that with unrest 100 or more you cannot recruit units!

good play
Liga

[Rainbow]

Regarding how Restless Worshippers work, try to do a forum search on "dominion.pdf". Download and read the whole thing (twice), or just search the document for the answer.

Basicly, Restless Worshippers are nice if you rely on dominion spread from non-preaching effects (pretender, prophet, temples, capital), and Ceremonial Faith is what you want if you are relying on preaching for dominion spread.

/Rainbow

[Sheap]

Thank you to everyone for your good answers.

However I have another question, of course.

How much Earth magic is required to be immune to Wind Ride? If you don't have that much, are your chances of being affected less, or is it immune/not immune?

Similarly for unit size. How big do you need to be and does it help if you are big, but not quite that big?

[Scott Hebert]

From my own observations of unrest/income relationships, I believe the way they are related is logarithmic in nature, in an inverse relationship. That is, as unrest increases, income decreases, but the reduction differential always decreases (towards 0). I've noted that, after taking a rich province with high unrest, I still get a good proportion of the province's 'normal' income (income with no unrest). OTOH, even low amounts of unrest can reduce income significantly. These observations have led to the above hypothesis.

What the modding parameters would do, under this system, is move the point where income is halved, but the effects on either side would not be as affected.

It'd be much easier to describe this graphically, but I don't know exactly if I could do it here.

Anyway, I hope this helps.