God in the gate

[PhilD]

Originally posted by Chris Byler:

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Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

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Originally posted by Chris Byler:
On the other hand, you do still gain skill for attempts you survive, so if you can cure insanity, you can make some slow progress. The Chalice, Gift of Health, Arco priestesses, Fairy Queen; park any or all of those in R'lyeh's old capitol (priestesses and the FQ will need a water breathing item of course) and keep trying with whoever got out of Arkham this month.

Or most obviously, empower a Recuperating leader in astral... and give it shambler skin armor, of course... 50 pearls, 5 water gems for the ultimate summoner? Not bad...

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Duh, how did I miss that one?

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I don't know - I only tried R'lyeh once, but I seem to remember that insanity wasn't the only danger - a significant proportion of summonners would meet something nasty in there, and not even come back with their mind fried. I don't think Recuperation would help much for that...

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by PhilD:
I don't know - I only tried R'lyeh once, but I seem to remember that insanity wasn't the only danger - a significant proportion of summonners would meet something nasty in there, and not even come back with their mind fried. I don't think Recuperation would help much for that...

A scripted returning with a ritual of returning enchantment can do wonders to make sure your summoner comes back alive even if he gets attacked.

However, the fact of the matter is that for anyone who ISN'T R'lyeh, the only use of the Void Gate would be to get Vastnesses. Even assuming you can entirely prevent the loss of your summoner with Returning/Ritual of Returning, and he automatically heals his insanity afflictions quickly, every time he teleports back, you still have to walk him BACK to R'lyeh, which R'lyeh doesn't have to do...and the insanity rate is 5x higher: Building an army out of void critters in such a fashion isn't profitable or cost-effective. So what you REALLY want is a Vastness.

Just wish for the damn Vastness already! 100 Astrals is a lot cheaper than trying to empower somebody to do it, cast Ritual of Returning and Returning all the time, teleport back to R'lyeh....

[Chris Byler]

Originally posted by Norfleet:

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Originally posted by PhilD:
I don't know - I only tried R'lyeh once, but I seem to remember that insanity wasn't the only danger - a significant proportion of summonners would meet something nasty in there, and not even come back with their mind fried. I don't think Recuperation would help much for that...

A scripted returning with a ritual of returning enchantment can do wonders to make sure your summoner comes back alive even if he gets attacked.

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Bodyguards help too. So does Ring of Warning. So does any item that is commonly useful in/against assasination (any summoning item, Rod of the Phoenix or other 100-PREC attack items).

However, the fact of the matter is that for anyone who ISN'T R'lyeh, the only use of the Void Gate would be to get Vastnesses. Even assuming you can entirely prevent the loss of your summoner with Returning/Ritual of Returning, and he automatically heals his insanity afflictions quickly, every time he teleports back, you still have to walk him BACK to R'lyeh, which R'lyeh doesn't have to do...and the insanity rate is 5x higher: Building an army out of void critters in such a fashion isn't profitable or cost-effective. So what you REALLY want is a Vastness.

Just wish for the damn Vastness already! 100 Astrals is a lot cheaper than trying to empower somebody to do it, cast Ritual of Returning and Returning all the time, teleport back to R'lyeh....

Astral mages don't have to walk anywhere. Assuming you have a bit of research and a couple astral pearls, that is (and if you've conquered R'lyeh, you have a couple of astral pearls). Gateway may have been moved further up the research tree, but Teleport is still where it always was.

Wish costs a lot more than 100 astral if you don't have an astral-9 god. You need several booster items (probably including the costly Rings of Sorcery and Wizardry) and possibly empowerment too. It's one thing to cast a level 9 battlefield spell (potentially with the aid of gems, empowerment, booster spells, Crystal Shield, etc.); it's quite another to cast a level 9 ritual.

Still, I have to admit that using the Void Gate as non-R'lyeh is as much a tour de force as anything else. Most of the low level void critters are only marginally worth it for R'lyeh, let alone for anyone else.

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by Chris Byler:
Astral mages don't have to walk anywhere. Assuming you have a bit of research and a couple astral pearls, that is (and if you've conquered R'lyeh, you have a couple of astral pearls). Gateway may have been moved further up the research tree, but Teleport is still where it always was.

That's not my point: For a R'lyeh player building a summoner at his Void Gate, every time he pops off a Returning or Ritual of Returning when a summoning goes pear-shaped, he goes to R'lyeh...but he's already there, so next turn, he can start again. If you're NOT R'lyeh, you go back to YOUR capitol, and then you have to haul your *** BACK to R'lyeh, costing an extra turn.

Wish costs a lot more than 100 astral if you don't have an astral-9 god. You need several booster items (probably including the costly Rings of Sorcery and Wizardry) and possibly empowerment too.

Meh. A Starshine, Crystal Amulet, and maybe a Sorcery, Wizardry, or the Book can give you a +3 Astral easily enough. Astral-6 isn't all that hard to acquire, and besides, once you have Astral-9, all doors are open to you. If you're fooling around with the Void Gate when not R'lyeh, I don't think cost is a concern for you anyway.