Glaive confusion

[Adept]

The late medieval classic is causing me gray hairs.



I'm working on a weapon balance mod, cleaning up some of the oddities we're left with from the original Dominions days. There's something that's very puzzling to me.

Several troops in the game have glaives + shields. That makes no sense with a 2-h polearm, but more importantly, I don't understand how it's possible in the game anyway. The glaive looks like it's a 2h weapon, but still some troops manage to have shields with it. What's going on?

[Corinthian]

I suspect that some big units can use two handed weapons in one hand. War shamblers is one example, the lord of the gate and his starting flail is another.....

I don't know of any unit with size smaller than 3, that can use two-handed weapons one-handed.



Also, it was very possible to strap a light shield, like a buckler, on your arm and still use a two handed weapon. but in those cases the bucklers worked more like over sized bracers than a shield.

[Adept]

That could well be it. I suppose some testing will figure it out. Still a pretty odd thing that shield and polearm.

[DeadlyShoe]

there's also Mournful, they use Halberds and Turtle Shell Shields.

I look for any sort of correlation but I think it's either hardcoded or just a special rule.

[13lackGu4rd]

yeah, generally in the fantasy genre when talking about 2 handed weapons you're referring to humans. so larger creatures than humans can sometimes use these 2 handed weapons with just 1 hand. I think only bows, that actually requires the usage of both hands, 1 to hold the bow and 1 to hold the arrow, are still 2 handed for all creatures.

[thejeff]

Though none of that applies to forged weapons. They can be passed from Hoburg to Titan and each uses the same slots.

For weapons assigned to units, hardcoded or through modding, I don't think limits apply. It's up the coder to be sure it makes sense.

[DeadlyShoe]

i always assume modding uses the same logic as forged items, since if you give a unit a new weapon it usually replaces the existing weapon etc.

Though there are some exceptions. For example, some of the heroes in the Worthy Heroes mod somehow ended up with a spear and 2 shields.

[Linraen]

Judging from my experience, it's possible (though by no means common) to have something like a short, one-handed glaive, and a shield.

The other, very real, option, is the one proposed by Corinthian, where you strap a buckler to your off hand. It's effective, but it can't be anything larger than a buckler (so if it's larger in game, it shouldn't be there).

However, in the case of game units (not the large ones that beat you up with two or more human-sized great mauls, anyway) it's either a programming/modding glitch or a case of confused definitions, I think.

Upd. to clear up the 'one-handed glaive' thing - considering how a glaive is just a spear with a wierd head, and how spears have been known across the agest to be able to both cut and thrust, AND have two- and one-handed variations, I guess it is possible.