Shattered Soul for tartarians. Do tell !

[TheMenacer]

I think an awesome endgame summon for the neifel/jotunheim nation series would be an awakened rimtursar giant. Granted Neifelheim doesn't really need any help as far as SC's go, but it'd still be cool to have a really really insane giant lording it over the garden variety neifel jarl and just stomping all kinds of faces in. Plus thematically it'd be great considering that neifelheim goes so far as to have a global that heralds the return of the rimtursar but doesn't actually have any of the giants themselves show up. I'm thinking it'd be pretty cool if they had pretty average stats, but completely ridiculous cold power, so that if you wanted them to be any good at all, you'd almost have to throw up Illwinter, but if you did have Illwinter up to maintain that cold temperature, then they will kick so much *** that every other player will probably go blind.

[Twan]

kasnavada said:

I can easily imagine Prince/Princess of magma 3F1E or 2F2E, coming out of either fire or earth spells. It would be less random than what tartarians currently have though... After all one of the fire kings has 1 earth. Or maybe make those dual path-summons and just stick to "hardcoded" paths.

Para-elemental (2 elements) creatures in general can easily be designed as they are classical d&d (and many other old rpg) monsters.

You can have magma princes for fire earth, but also smoke queens for fire air, vapor queens for fire water (or acid queens as fire+water=acid in dominions, and because it's one of the best song from the who), ice princes for water earth, fog kings for water air, dust ones for earth air...

[MaxWilson]

+1 to Rimtursar w/ ridiculous Cold Power. Skratti aren't going to be satisfied with the "Illwinter" global; Summon Rimtursar (W7B4) gives them something new to obsess about.

C'tis already has the Devourer of Souls, but it doesn't have any magic. Except that, not only are C'tissians well-suited to summoning/GoR'ing Tartarians, but it's also kind of thematic w/ the Egyptian motif (Greek <=> Egyptian influence). So maybe they should stick with that.

Obviously Lanka will be summoning Rakshasa, and Kailasa will be summoning Devata.

LA Agartha is fine w/ Tomb Oracles (they're about as good as Tartarians, IMHO, except for the lack of randoms, and Air/Blood/Astral randoms for Agartha wouldn't be thematic). EA Agartha could have... whatever it is that's locked away in the vault the Umbrals are guarding. Maybe giant life-draining Hecatoncheires that spread disease and death in all the provinces they're in, like the Harvester of Souls but without stealth.

-Max

[PvK]

All those Tartarian-rivals are utterly moddable. Also you could add cheaper versions of the national summons at higher research levels, as is done in many cases now except even more efficient versions to compete. e.g. MA Ulm could have a Construction-9 3E1F spell to summon Iron Golems for 1 earth gem...

[hunt11]

what about dragons, though they would lack some of the slots they would make up for it. Who needs magic armor when your natural protection is better, who needs magic AOE weapons when you do it naturally.

For the actual cost about 70-90 gems would work, because of not only the actual power, their is also the fact that the dragon would be have at least 4 levels in one magic path

[TheMenacer]

MaxWilson said:
LA Agartha is fine w/ Tomb Oracles (they're about as good as Tartarians, IMHO, except for the lack of randoms, and Air/Blood/Astral randoms for Agartha wouldn't be thematic). EA Agartha could have... whatever it is that's locked away in the vault the Umbrals are guarding. Maybe giant life-draining Hecatoncheires that spread disease and death in all the provinces they're in, like the Harvester of Souls but without stealth.

-Max

I'm not really sure if tomb oracles are much of a replacement for tartarians. The problem isn't so much that tomb oracles are bad because they very much aren't, it's just that they're three times the cost and aren't as strong on their lonesome plus they're attached to a nation that isn't going to have much of an issue getting its hands on some tartarians in the first place. They're good, they're just outclassed in all the ways that count. Off the top of my head, it'd be crazy awesome to get something like an enormous undead ageless olm that just goes completely bananas all over everyone. Dang, someone should really start a "suggest national summons to replace tartarians" thread.

[MaxWilson]

I don't think Tartarians are substantially cheaper than Tomb Oracles. Tartarians are 10d + 20n (for Gift of Reason), Tomb Oracles are 30d. But maybe you're right. 85 HP vs. 170 HP for Tartarians, Size 4 vs. Size 6, and no randoms. (The Earth/Air Tartarians are the best in my opinion.) On the other hand, Agartha doesn't have as easy of a time getting Tartarians as C'tis does because there aren't any national mages who can cast Gift of Reason, forge the Chalice, or cast Gift of Health.

So, maybe some super Tomb Oracles with extra randoms--it seems to me that the HP difference is a relatively minor point. (Seraphs have only 77 HP.) Undead Olm is a possibility too.

-Max

[Lingchih]

I would love to see a boosted Treant too, a version that is not unique. A powerful nature mage could go into the forest, find a sleeping ancient Treant, and awaken him. Nature needs a powerful late game summon.

The Treant would have a super move potential, like 3, powerful nature, earth and water capabilities, and slots (slots are so nice... they are what makes an SC). They would, of course, have great HP and regen, but would be susceptible to fire. Does my description ring any bells?

[kasnavada]

Lords of the ring ? ^^

I'd love it too. I'd also love the "dark" version they speak of in the books, even if we don't see them.

[Zeldor]

I am fine with mapmove 1 on treant as long as they can use Flying Carpet They also do not need many slots as long as they have really cool built-in abilities.