2004 Presidential Election.

[Will]

AlterNet critique of Bush on National Security.

[Instar]

Gozra said:
I am reading A history of the American Navy in WWII. Mahan's I believe. I was stunned by the preface. My Wife and I visited the Battleship North Carolin in Wilimington North Carolina I remember telling her That For a Battleship with 16 inch guns it was really a small ship. The in the preface Of the Navy history book I am reading it pointed out that prior to WWII the Peace activists put pressure on The US to sign treaties with the other big powers to limit the size and makeup of the navies then being built. Well many of the other Countries proceeded to 'Cheat'(the US did not) So when WWII broke out the US had the wimpiest fleet because The 'Be nice at all cost' crowd had succeeded in tying the hands of the US navy.
What I think this boils down to is subscribing to the view that everyone will do what is best for everyone else will just get you kicked in the teeth and stomped on.

The truth of the matter is that the US got the good end of the treaty. The ratio was like for every 2 tons Japan got, the US got 5 tons. Britain and France got 4 or 5 as well. More info:
http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Was...n_Naval_Treaty

The treaty was signed in 1922, and was probably ignored by everyone by the late 1930s. In fact, the treaty was ended in 1936, leaving enough time for all navies involved to grow.

Oh, and I voted Kerry (absentee ballot) because all of Bush's positions are immoral and I disagree with all of his positions.

[Azselendor]

Actually, the damage done to the economy cannot be held against clinton as during the Last few months of his administration, the republican impeachment crippled all of his policies and his ability to carry them out.

Clinton was turned into a lame duck president after the impeachment hearings and paved the way to the dot com bust.

[Gandalf Parker]

Instar said:
Oh, and I voted Kerry (absentee ballot) because all of Bush's positions are immoral and I disagree with all of his positions.

Im happy to say that I have listened to most of the presidential candidates, particularly Bush and Kerry of course. I have been swayed most by things said by Bush. (not to vote for him)

[MythicalMino]

I am voting Bush, but listening to Mellencamp on my way to the polls.....

[Instar]

Gandalf Parker said:

Im happy to say that I have listened to most of the presidential candidates, particularly Bush and Kerry of course. I have been swayed most by things said by Bush. (not to vote for him)

The "debates" were ok, mostly ridiculous. They're both career politicians, and I severely dislike those things.

I should clarify why Bush's positions are immoral and wrong:
Science - His conservative staff and such are impeding science, something most abhorrent to me. Not just stem cells, mind you. Several federal studies that conservative Groups hated have been dropped from federal funding. Consider the study of disease vectors: a study done on how truck stops play roles in the transmission of diseases. The research was done on all aspects of how a truck stop and truckers spread disease: drugs, prostitutes, truck chasers, etc.. Conservative "Christian" Groups hated it and had Bush and Co. stop it.
Stem Cells - see above. Science ought not be so impeded.
Abortion - Bush is wrong again, see Judith Jarvis Thompson's "A Defense of Abortion," no one has yet countered it in my mind.
International relations - Bush is a joke here.
Gay Marriage - Bush is wrong again. Society will not crumble if we give equal rights to everyone, we can look overseas at different countries to see this.
Missile Defense - Needs to be rethought and redesigned. I am for a solution that works, however, the current one is iffy at best.
Tax Cuts - They are good when you have spare cash, but we don't! National debt is dangerously high.

[Raging Deadstar]

Lol, I'm in england, it's 4:30am and I have insomnia So I'm watching the election stuff, Got to admit it's got me hooked now

Very clsoe stuff so far, Hoping for a Kerry win personally (politics is global no?) but you guys really know how to throw a close election!

[Atrocities]

YYYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSS VICTORY .

The President is still the President with both tains in the Senate and the House..... I would call that one hell of a GREAT VICTORY.

[Instar]

Atrocities said:
YYYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSS VICTORY .

The President is still the President with both tains in the Senate and the House..... I would call that one hell of a GREAT VICTORY.

hooray. 4 more years of "compassionate" conservatives and christian right wing. I'm so thrilled.

[Jack Simth]

Instar said:
I should clarify why Bush's positions are immoral and wrong:
Science - His conservative staff and such are impeding science, something most abhorrent to me. Not just stem cells, mind you. Several federal studies that conservative Groups hated have been dropped from federal funding. Consider the study of disease vectors: a study done on how truck stops play roles in the transmission of diseases. The research was done on all aspects of how a truck stop and truckers spread disease: drugs, prostitutes, truck chasers, etc.. Conservative "Christian" Groups hated it and had Bush and Co. stop it.
Stem Cells - see above. Science ought not be so impeded.
Abortion - Bush is wrong again, see Judith Jarvis Thompson's "A Defense of Abortion," no one has yet countered it in my mind.

So he is wrong because his ethics conflict with yours?

Instar said:
International relations - Bush is a joke here.

Most international relations between the more powerful and the less powerful are a joke anymore. As there are very few, if any, other nations with the military and economic clout of the US, most international relations involving the US will be a joke, regardless of who is president.

Instar said:
Gay Marriage - Bush is wrong again. Society will not crumble if we give equal rights to everyone, we can look overseas at different countries to see this.

What's the longest a society that was founded with exclusively (or nearly so) "traditional" marriage has survived after "non-traditional" marriges have become widespread? Perhaps it is simply a matter of caution; a "wait and see" on how well those more permissive countries are doing 50-60 years from now before jumping on the bandwagon. Meanwhile, there are a few states that do permit such, and the federal government has no constitutional authority on that issue (for now, granted - but changing that would just about take a constitutional amendment - requireing 2/3 of the states to ratify it, and likely a few decades).

Instar said:
Missile Defense - Needs to be rethought and redesigned. I am for a solution that works, however, the current one is iffy at best.

Most methods of defense are iffy at best; the ones that are less iffy, such as the capacity for swift and utter annihilation of an attacker (aka ICBMs with nuclear warheads), are extremely unpopular on the international scene (and the local scene, too). Which is prefferable? An iffy defense that doesn't make all the other countries extremely nervous or a reasonably practical defense that does?

Instar said:
Tax Cuts - They are good when you have spare cash, but we don't! National debt is dangerously high.

It's not so much the debt as the deficit that's the issue - but yeah, tax cuts are rather impractical at the moment. Of course, the debt is growing, and no politician can really afford to have a platform of RAISING taxes, now can they?