OT: Insightful (re: Amish shooting)

[Slynky]

Thank you, AMF, for posting this. I might suggest the subject title should be, "Inciteful" instead...as any decent man should rail againt [censored] like this!

[Puke]

narf poit chez BOOM said:
Soviet Russia was Athiest. Now, how about we stop that track before it gets out of hand?

wow, they really were godless commies? i never knew! this gives me a new-found respect for the Soviets.

[Puke]

dmm said:If ALL moral systems are simply opinion, then ALL are a load of crap. In that case, anyone who doesn't do whatever he can get away with is a fool. So Ted Bundy was smart to rape and kill little girls. Why not?

well sure thats true. but while its true, heres the "why not":

our shared set of laws and mutually-agreed sense of "morality" is generally beneficial to those that participate in it. it provides some sense of assurance that the horrible things that you spare other from, will in turn be spared delivery upon you.

The other part of "why not" is that you might fear reprisal, either legal or extralegal. Ted Bundy might not have been smart to comit his crimes, when you consider what came to him. If the consequences of his actions dont outweigh the pleasure he got from them, then sure he was smart to do it. or at least a rational economic actor.

on the other hand, I certainly would have gouged his eyes out if I had the chance. Not because it would be my Moral obligation to do so, but because it helps uphold our (society's) mutually consentual system of laws and morals. "morals" not "Morals". It benefits me to uphold them, so i do.

[Renegade 13]

rdouglass said:
Morality is a purely human concept.

God is sovereign so morality is not relevant.

I know it sounds lame but God doesn't have to explain anything to us humans. There are stories in the Bible where God instructs a leader to kill *all* traces of another people or village. If the leaders did not follow his command, He punished those leaders as well for not following His will.

That would not be moral by any human standard. But that's the point; God is not human but He is sovereign. Putting morality and God together just doesn't work in any explination that would satisfy any logical human. So don't bother trying; it's a stupid arguement. God doesn't have to explain *anything* to us yet we will have to explain *everything* to Him.

We *will* have to explain to Him our reasonings and our belief (or lack of) that we post here on this forum whether you choose to believe that now or not. I know what I want to be able to say....

I'll just say that I disagree with you on all counts, and leave it there. I don't want to start religious flaming, and know there can be no reasoning with people who think like you obviously do.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

On-topic, please. We've barely touched the original topic.

[Elsemeravin]

narf poit chez BOOM said:
On-topic, please. We've barely touched the original topic.

Let's go back to the original discussion, for the origine ofthe universe most important topic.... CHEESE !

[Xrati]

Can we say that the original topic of the �de-humanization� and violence against women exists because of our inability to focus on the subject and we continue to deviate from the Topic? Maybe our attention span is so short these days that we actually lose track of where we are going!
We live in such a fast paced society that just maybe we need to pay more attention to the topics rather then move on to other subjects like religion. Violence against women is a serious subject and maybe if we just focused our attention on it we could actually do something about it.

[Fyron]

Traditional male domination over women has to do with fundamental genetic imperatives deriving from the makeup of male and female humans and the roles that almost always came about as a result of it... Noone said all of these genetic imperatives were necessarily good things. Some must be striven to overcome.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

The most pathetic scene in an action movie for me is the one where the villian taunts the hero with the heroes' violent impulses.

'Oh, he's just like you? Which one of you kills for fun, again?'

Some people think that because they have an urge, they must satisfy that urge. This leads to shoplifting, addiction, murder, violence and oppression.

We have self-control for a reason.

[ZeroAdunn]

narf poit chez BOOM said:
However, saying that I can't prove it to myself is to make a blanket judgement of every single experience of my life - The vast majority of which you know nothing about and do not have the right to do, anyway.

Actually Narf, you can't prove it to yourself. We can't prove anything beyond our own moment to moment, each morning you wake up and take a leap of faith that all that has come before, truly did come before, and isn't just some delusion or fabrication. Faith is probably the most powerful thing in this world, everybody has it, few people understand it, and a good portion of the population don't want ot admit to it, but its their. There is nothing in this life that can be proven, each moment in time is like a photograph, at the moment it is taken, you know it is true, but forever after you can only make your claims, and hope somebody will back you up.