Conceptual Balance Series (Mod)

[Oversway]

This is great stuff, thanks to all who helped make them!

[Turin]

Since you didn�t change the item mod, here is a version without typos and better readability.

[Edi]

*bangs head against wall*

Turin, I specifically changes the formatting and readability, just didn't touch the modifications. That version you just did has nothing to offer and indeed has none of the syntax editing that the version in the package has. If you want to edit something, edit that one first, if indeed it has any typoes. Or I can do that and repost the whole package. I didn't just go through days of editing hell to have my hard work immediately torpedoed by introducing non-standard formatting!

Edi

[Turin]

well I made that one before you posted yours already and I didn�t really see any changes you made except making the headlines in big letters.

In my version I put the weapon changes under the corresponding artifacts, so you can see cost and weapon changes at the same time and fixed several item affecting typos(lightning spear, lucky coin, shield of the accursed, cauldron of broth, hydra skin armor) and removed lines that weren�t needed. I don�t know if that adds nothing

I really appreciate the work you did here and wouldn�t have posted it, but it seemed to me that you hadn�t done much with the item mod, so my fixed version could save some work. But I guess if the format is so important to you I should remove it.

[quantum_mechani]

Thanks a ton, Edi. Now, what program do you use to edit the mods? Otherwise, when I make a new version, we have to do this all over again.

[Edi]

Quantum:

I use Crimson Editor. You can find it here. Completely free, very versatile and conforms to standards. Can be used for code developing for several programming languages (key word and structural color highlighting makes it easy to read code)and for basic text editing. It has very nifty search functions, search and replace, various text editing features such as case changing etc and Once I found this little program about three years ago, I have used it exclusively for basic text file editing.

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Turin:

I specifically didn't do much structural changes for the item mod because I have not had time to get very familiar with it. Your approach, grouping weapon editing along with gem cost and path editing for items does have its merits (mainly convenience in maintaining that specific mod), but it also has its drawbacks (everything being mingled together).

The current format where the gem cost and path requirement edits are in one section and the actual equipment modding in another is in my opinion superior, because it allows other modmakers who might like the equipment changes but not the cost changes to copy the whole chunks to use as basis for their own mods (if they want just one or the otehr but not both). It would also be structurally consistent with the rest of the CB series. You can rest assured that when I do start going through it, things are going to get moved around pretty drastically. Basically you can expect stuff to be grouped by category (weapons, armor, miscellaneous) and level (trinket, lesser item, greater item, artefact) and possibly sorted by primary and secondary paths as well. Equipment modding would be in one section and the forging mods in another and both sections categorized as above.

I might actually do that before I do the Nations readme, just to get it out of the way.

If at all possible, I would like to retain editorial control of the format so that the rest of you can concentrate on content improvement. I can chime in on that as well, but not all that much.

Edi

[Turin]

I think my approach is definitely superior.
Which scenario is more likely: a would be modder considers the item mod and thinks: " I surely like the cost changes, but dislike all the weapon changes" , or him thinking " I mostly like the changes of this mod, but there are items x,y and z which I could mod better".

My approach is superior for the much more likely scenario 2.

Basically it boils down to this: my approach is better for the modder/ overall readability, your approach might be better for a modder who wants to throw out huge parts of the mod. As for structural consistency, it already is really annoying in the spell mod to check out the changes zen made to the units, which is one of the reason why I made a special blackunitview map for it.

I�ll happily let you retain the editorial control(not that I have anything to say in that matter as it�s primarily quantum�s /zen�s mod), but splitting the changes in several parts destroys the readability. Sorting the items by class is a really good idea though.

[Edi]

On reflection, I suppose that you're right in this instance. I'll make that change.

I'm going to put out a new version of the Item mod out later today, with the changes I outlined above. It's also going to be a Null Mod in the sense that I've added the #selectitem "<item name>" and #end lines for every single bleeding item that it is possible to build, categorized by type etc and all in the same construction levels and in the same order as they appear in the unmodded game.

Those should stay static, and changes in construction level should not cause them to move around, because otehrwise it is going to be a pain in the arse to try and find anything, especially if things change from version to version. The original author of the mod ought to be shot, it was impossible to find anything without scrolling through the whole file or using a search function.

There are also some item cost and level modifications that I personally violently disagree with, but we can talk about those later, I'm not going to meddle around with them now.

As for the spell mod, in that one the structure of speel edits in one section and unit edits in another is the only reasonable approach because the unit edits take up such a massive amount of space and the units are going to be edited very rarely compared to spell attributes. The readme should also help somewhat.

Another note on the spell mod: I didn't tinker with the contents, but Soul Gate Ermor had gotten quite the discount in its national spells, specifically the Wraith Consul and Senator. Never mind that they are immortal to begin with and also have unholy magic in spades, the consul now costs less to summon than a Wraith Centurion. That struck me as out of whack.

Edi

[Chazar]

Nice stuff!

(BTW: You could shorten the nation mod by three lines, for the seraph gets his magical skills (2A,1W) deleted and replaced by (2A,1W).)

[Turin]

the wraith senator was pretty useless, because unholy 3 isn�t much of an improvement over unholy 2 priests(where you get a ton for free), basically it�s only useful for summoning apparitions, which you get for free anyway.

His major drawback is that he doesn�t come with any equipment, he doesn�t even have a real weapon, so a wraith centurion is the better choice for a fighter. Even at 11 gems I�d probably still summon exclusively centurions. He might have a niche if you want to equip him as a thug though, because his stats are marginally better than the centurions.

As for the wraith consul, I too thought they were fine at 35 gems, because lvl 4 unholy is actually useful and the better stats are nice as well.