Forbidden Magic: Darkness and Light!

[Xavier]

moderation asked if I could host this - which I'm happy to do. Give me a complete list of game options and I'll get the server up so people can upload pretenders - I'll just need to know when to start it.

Things are kinda crazy for me right now though, so it'd be best if you (moderation) would be in touch with me about this via PM rather than expecting me to remember to check back in this thread....

The only caveat is that it looks as though I'll (unexpectedly) be moving in the middle of next week. It should only result in 1, maximum 2, days of downtime though.

[CUnknown]

I guess first the thing you have to decide is: 2 teams or 3 teams? Which factions are on which team? How many players do you want? What map?

And then maybe decide: What are the rules regarding what spells/paths different factions can use?

And then stuff like: What age? Do you want to use any mods? etc.

[Tuidjy]

World of Geometry is huge. No way it can be blitzed. You need something smaller.

[CUnknown]

I have some ideas on how this could be done. You don't have to follow my ideas.. we could do this multiple times, make different games based on the good v evil idea.

Anyway, here is my idea for the game structure:

GOOD v EVIL v NEUTRAL

On the brink of global war.

Over the centuries, a group of shining, virtuous nations have formed a pact for mutual defense and peaceful coexistence. This small group of kingdoms worships a pantheon of gods, all different -- yet all the same. Four aspects of the same all-powerful god. They will stand as one in the upcoming War of Ascension. All will rise to glory, or all will fall into the pit of Tartarus for eternal suffering.

Another group of nations, evil, vicious, has also arisen. They, too, all worship different aspects of the same god, yet this god is so posionous that It has corrupted their minds and they do not understand their linked fate. They too will rise to glory as one, or fall into disgrace, but they are too blinded by arrogance to realize this essential fact. They want nothing but to expand across the globe, killing and enslaving any nation which stands in their way, preferably the "good" ones. They are not organized, but far more numerous than the League of Virtue.

Only a couple nations remain neutral in this upcoming fight. They may trade will anyone, good or evil, but their Council of Elders are isolationist in nature, and they will not permit coordinated military action with any other faction, including other neutrals. They may seem to be completely doomed, without hope, but their Gods are strong and their merchants shrewd, and they have been blessed with an abundance of material wealth.

Now for the nuts and bolts:

GOOD

Disadvantages:
The League of Virtue is few in number: 4 factions.

They despise Death and Blood magic, and are forbidden to use these paths (except for anti-undead spells such as Wither Bones). They cannot trade for death or blood items with NEUTRALS. If they happen upon a blood site, they must let these slaves sit and rot in their vault. Do NOT use them for ANY purpose. Death gems, however, may be used solely to alchemetize to astral pearls.

They are forbidden to have any contact with the EVIL races (Do not discuss the game -at all- with any of these races).

They are limited in the topics they may discuss with the NEUTRAL races (see the NEUTRAL races for more detail).

They are forbidden from eliminating their own players.

They are forbidden from possessing the capital of another GOOD player (except temporarily if it has been conquered).

Advantages:
They will all start together (they have each other's back).

They are able to talk and discuss amongst themselves freely, by e-mail, in game contact -- any method and any topic.

If one of them dies, (s)he may give all items and gems to others in the League.

Victory Conditions
Elimination of all EVIL players.
Possession of all GOOD capitals.


EVIL

Disadvantages:
They are forbidden to have any contact with the GOOD or EVIL races (Do not discuss the game -at all- with any of these races). EVIL cannot plan strategies or coordinate their efforts in -any- way. They cannot trade screenshots. They cannot -talk at all- amongst themselves.

They cannot discuss their Pretender choices before the game starts.

Each is prohibited from giving anything to any other faction upon their death.

They are limited in the topics they may discuss with the NEUTRAL races (see the neutral races for more detail).

They are randomly distributed throughout the world.

Advantages:

They are overwhelmingly numerous: 8 factions.
They may corrupt all forms of magic for their own use.
They may eliminate their own players at will.

Victory Conditions

Elimination of all GOOD and NEUTRAL players.


NEUTRALS

Disadvantages:

They are limited in the topics they may discuss with all races. They may discuss: trading gold, gems, items, provinces, world maps (screenshots). Non-aggression pacts. "Please stop x (inciting unrest, etc.)" messages. That is all. No coordinated military actions with -any- other faction!! No trading -any- military info on -any- other nation beyond what you can show in world-map screenshots. You are -forbidden- to trade battle screenshots.

--> If they trade screenshots to an EVIL player, that EVIL player is honor-bound not to show them to his/her allies. All EVIL players must purchase the screenshots individually from the NEUTRAL players if they want to see how the world looks apart from their own corner of it.

Each NEUTRAL race is prohibited from giving anything to any other faction upon their death. All trades must be legit -- no trading 1000 gold for 100 gold. You are honor-bound to play in your own self-interest.
Addendum - NEUTRAL races are stubbornly proud and will refuse to give tribute to any race for any purpose. Trades which are slightly uneven are okay, as long as it is debateable. Simply handing 1000 gold to the nearest EVIL race "Please don't kill me" is not allowed. (i.e. making an unfair trade as a plea for survival (being a "forge *****") is not allowed). NEUTRAL races will live free, or die!

They are on their own. There are 2 NEUTRAL races, but they are not a team.

They are randomly distributed throughout the world.

Advantages:

They may use all forms of magic.
They may eliminate any player at will.
They are the only players the EVIL factions can say anything to, including their own allies!
They are extremely weathly: they start the game with 1500 gold and 10 gems of every type.

Victory Conditions

Standard Dominions victory condition: There Can Be Only One. Ascend or get thrown into Tartarus! Sucks to be you, NEUTRAL guys.

Remember if you kill all of the EVIL races first and don't hold any GOOD capitals, you lose. You sort of have to attack both.


Mods being used:

Single-Age Mod.
Complete Balance Mod.

Map:

I don't know yet.

Any race (from any Age) may be chosen as Good, Evil, or Neutral. I don't judge. But remember that Good races cannot use Death or Blood magic at all. I'd recommend taking a faction for Good that doesn't use these paths.

The NEUTRAL races in particular must be played by experienced, trustworthy players. They need to be a buffer between the EVIL and GOOD races in the beginning, or EVIL will just stomp over everything.

The EVIL races also need to be played by trustworthy players -- if they start communicating illegally, they will win hands-down.

Does this sound even remotely balanced? I have given it a lot of thought, but am certainly open to suggestions! I know it sucks for the neutral factions, they are not supposed to win. I am talking good v evil balance. Hopefully, though, with their extra gold and the fact that the EVIL races can only trade with them, the Neutral races won't get eliminated early by the EVIL races. The GOOD races have no real incentive to kill the NEUTRALS -- they don't need to in order to win.

I will start a new thread for this game if there is interest.

I'm not planning this as a blitz, the blitz can happen, too! Why not just have more games?

[Cor2]

I like it, alot. But who would want to be neutral?

[CUnknown]

I'll be neutral if no one else wants to be.

Imagine the glory if you manage to pull off a win!! And, you do start with 1500 gold and 10 gems of all types, that is enough for a killer start. Start building your second castle on turn 3.. get all the mercenaries.. and still have enough gold for your best mages and troops to begin with.

And GOOD won't attack you in the beginning -- they need your help against the overwhelming forces of EVIL (also they can win without killing you). EVIL may choose to go around you, since you are more powerful than them individually, and you are their only hope to trade for items they can't make themselves.

Ah, who am I kidding, EVIL is gonna stomp your a$$. Hehe, but it would be fun, I think!

I stayed up until like 3:30am thinking about this game concept, lol

The rules are basically unenforceable, people will need to be honorable as players for this to work, is the only problem.

[Amhazair]

I'm not sure about balance (at all) but the concept sure sounds fun. If you have trouble finding players willing to be neutral I might even be tempted, depending on what age the game will be in.

To go with the wealthy neutral theme, I would think it a good idea to add an iron mine or other bonus resource site to their start province too.

If they happen upon a death or blood site, they must let these gems/slaves sit and rot in their vault. Do NOT use them for ANY purpose.

How about alchemy? Thematically 'destroying the essence of evil made physical, and converting it to astral gems for the betterment of mankind' sounds good to me.

[CUnknown]

If you think the GOOD races are at a disadvantage, we could let them alchemetize the death gems.

I'm not sure they are at a disadvantage, though.. Being able to talk and coordinate is just huge.. Hmm... I dunno. We will vote on the death gem issue. I just don't want to have the GOOD races getting indy death mages and searching for sites. It's not thematic.

An iron mine for the NEUTRALS could be a good call.. we should vote on that as well.

And, this is all ages, we are going to use the Single Age mod (all Ages in one). Pick any faction you want.

[thejeff]

The only exception I'd suggest to the Blood and Death ban would be to allow the death anti-undead spells. I'm not sure if there are any equivalents in Blood. (And anything actually using Blood slaves is out.)

If not, mod out any Blood/Death paths from the Good nations.
Even if it's just a random.

[CUnknown]

Okay, using Wither Bones seems acceptable for the Good races. That is sensible. Good people can specialize in Death magic for the purpose of learning the weaknesses of undead, that makes perfect sense.

In that case, maybe we should go ahead and allow them to alchemitize death gems to astral.

I have modified the original post about this game to include wither bones and alchemy for death gems for Good races.

I also started up a new thread for this game. This is really a splinter game from the original idea, the original idea was good, too! I mostly just didn't want to play this as a blitz.