SE4 Stock Balance Mod

[PvK]

Sure, but most of these things go way beyond the simple balance mod proposed in this thread, and could be done in many different ways.

Personally, I like SEIV Meson BLasters at range 6. I guess it'd be ok to extend the tech tree some levels to give range-8 Versions, but you'd need to mod some AI files to get the AI to research them. Again, way beyond the scope of a simple balance mod.

Which isn't to say that more comprehensive balance mods wouldn't be good to have, for their own sake...

PvK

[spoon]

Originally posted by PvK:
Sure, but most of these things go way beyond the simple balance mod proposed in this thread, and could be done in many different ways.

I think they can be attainable by tweaking some combination of the following:
- cost
- range
- damage
- reload
- "to hit" (Weapon Modifier)

I think that will keep the mod within the range of "simple".

The Meson BLaster, for example, has a range (per tech level) of:
3,4,5,5,6,6

Changing that to:
3,4,5,6,7,8
wouldn't be much of a change at all.

[minipol]

Another thing would be to decrease the size of weapon platforms. I like to use them to defend my inner systems but you cannot build enough on medium planets IMO. Maybe their size should be decreased to allow more to e constructed on a planet.

Intel is way to unbalanced. If you build up your intel you can steal a few planets every turn. Not very realistic and quite unbalanced.

[Captain Kwok]

Nah, Meson bLasters are a bolt weapon. The best option for these guys is to slightly increase their damage while giving them a to hit penalty. Torpedoes should be the long range weapon instead, with no to hit bonus, just the range and maybe a tad more strength - that's it.

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by spoon:
- Talisman (increase cost by a factor of 10 +, and increase size*)

I think both of these are bad ideas. Either one would be fine for humans, but the AI isn't smart enough to use the Talisman more judiciously once it's more expensive. The result would be bankrupcy and military irrelevance for any AI programed to use it.

Mounts are interesting, but I think it would be a little bit too complicated of a change IMHO.

A better solution would be to soften the effectivness of the component. Someone suggested taking out the "always hits" ability and give it a 100% bonus to hit instead. This way it's still a powerful component reflecting it's cost and research, but it doesn't guarantee hits from ridiculously long range and can be countered with a lot of defensive bonuses by the opponent.

Just a suggestion anyway.

Regarding niche weapons. I agree that niche weapons are nice for flavor and what not. On the other hand I have always felt the torpedos deserved to be more then a niche weapon. I think changes made to bring them up to a viable front line weapon would be a good thing.

Regarding PPB. I think changing the ROF is a bad idea. I would support slightly weakening them, or making them more expensive, or possibly even a little of both. But changing the ROF would make tehm that much more of an inferior late game choice to the APB. The PPB is only "unbalenced" for a limited time in the mid game. It just so happens that time is when most games end so people get the impression it is an uber weapon. We need changes to make it less dominating in the mid game without making it irrelevant at the end.

Geoschmo

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by minipol:
Intel is way to unbalanced. If you build up your intel you can steal a few planets every turn. Not very realistic and quite unbalanced.

True, but that may be out of the scope of what we are trying to accomplish here. Intel will be difficult if not imposible to fix without fundamental hard code changes.

Geoschmo

[Suicide Junkie]

Remember the Point of this:
1) Do not affect AIs with your changes... Requiring re-written AIs means this won't become stock rules.

3) Least changes possible. Meson bLasters don't need to be changed from a moderately powered medium-range gun to a sniper rifle, for example.

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
Remember the Point of this:
1) Do not affect AIs with your changes... Requiring re-written AIs means this won't become stock rules.

Of course this is all conjecture anyway, but we might be able to get away with minor AI affecting changes. Like if someone wants to tweak the characteristic and racial trait costs a little bit. Because we can also modify the AI_general files to accomodate the changes and include those with the mod. But anything that is going to require serious rework of research and design files is gonna be a problem. And major changes to the characteristic and racial traits that would totally break everybodies favorite custom AI should probably be avoided as well.

Just my opinion of course.

Geoschmo

[TerranC]

Originally posted by spoon:
- Quantum Reactor (increase cost by a factor of 10 +, and increase size*)

What would that do? The AIs will still use it on all ships, and players will still use it, albeit with less frequency.

IMHO the right way to balance Quantum reactors is to get rid of the infinite supplies ability and make it generate a specific amount of supplies, like in the P&N Mod.

[Krsqk]

I would like to see all of the damage types used. I don't think Skips All Shields is used; the Double/Half/Quarter Damage to Shields aren't either. Maybe there are more that I don't remember off hand. Anyway, it's a shame to see them unused in the stock game.