Emergency Build problem

[sparhawk]

Ok, I get the picture: so what you are saying Geoschmo: always take 120% in maintance reduction!!! (if in a unmodded game), because it saved you 80% of the maintance.

But is this also true for other race traits, like research, trade, miniral extraction etc.
Because then this will open a totally new window for me: I really thought that upgrading from 100 to 120 % maintance reduction would give you 4/5 maintance instead of 5/5.

But WHY did they do that.
It would be more logical to do it the following way: maintance(25% of value ship) * (100 % / race trait maintance reduction).

Sparhawk

[geoschmo]

True, it probably would make more sense that way. But the maintenance reduction at game startup comes "off the top", subtracted directly from the base maint. The other things in the game that affect maint, components, facilities, maint reduction on hulls, all get multiplied so the reduction is more in line with what you would expect.

120% is quite valuable, but it is is also expensive. Some people prefer using those points in other areas. Depends on your play style I guess.

It used to be you could get your maint down to zero by maxing the characteristic maint redux and taking the engineer trait. Those were the days. One of the patches fixed it so the lowest you can get your maint is 5% now. If you spend the points to get it lower than that they are wasted cause your maint is hardcoded to the minimum.

Geoschmo

[sparhawk]

So having 120% reduction and having the crystalline restructuring plant, doens't lower it below 5% maintance cost???

And what about miniral extraction/research, is that still research/extraction * race trait???

Thanks Sparhawk

[Suicide Junkie]

No, Crystalline multiplies, so you will get 15% off of whatever you pay when the ship is outside the system.
IE 20% redux + 15% crystal = 17%

If you choose engineers or merchants, or one of the other cultures that reduce maintenance in your race setup, it adds/subtracts from the base along with the maintenance redux.

[geoschmo]

The crystal restructuring planet can lower the maint of individual ships in a system below 5%. But it's multiplied, so it can't get to zero. It's just the empire base maint that is hardcoded at 5%.

If I understand the second question, then yes. Your empire rate of resource production is multiplied by the rate of production of the facility(which increases with tech level) multiplied by the resource value of the planet multiplied by population factors(happiness, number).

Geoschmo

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
No, Crystalline multiplies, so you will get 15% off of whatever you pay when the ship is outside the system.
IE 20% redux + 15% crystal = 17%

Ummm, what? Is this something in your mod? I don't know all the details of that. This is not how it works in the stock game.

An empire with 120% maint would have a 5% empire base maint. So they would pay 5% maint everywhere else but would pay 4.25% maint for any ships in a system with a crystal restructuring facility.

But to get crystalline race and 120% maint reduction would be quite expensive. You'd need to be playing 5000 racial points, or take some pretty hefty cuts in other areas.

Geoschmo

[ December 11, 2002, 15:18: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

[Ruatha]

Originally posted by geoschmo:

quote:

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Originally posted by Ruatha:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pablo:
One is enough for the whole empire

Then the description in the build screen is wrong, there it says that it will convert resources made in the system.
I've built 10 of them in a game

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Actually it doesn't. It does have the "(only 1 facility per system effective)" line in the ability description, which is kind of wierd I will admit. But it doesn't say anything anywhere about converting resources from that system only.

Geoschmo

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O, sorry. My mistake! (early dementia)

[Suicide Junkie]

Originally posted by geoschmo:

quote:

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Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
No, Crystalline multiplies, so you will get 15% off of whatever you pay when the ship is outside the system.
IE 20% redux + 15% crystal = 17%

Ummm, what? Is this something in your mod? I don't know all the details of that. This is not how it works in the stock game.

An empire with 120% maint would have a 5% empire base maint. So they would pay 5% maint everywhere else but would pay 4.25% maint for any ships in a system with a crystal restructuring facility.

But to get crystalline race and 120% maint reduction would be quite expensive. You'd need to be playing 5000 racial points, or take some pretty hefty cuts in other areas.

Geoschmo

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17 Percent of normal! (where normal is 25%) Sorry

4.25 * 4 = 17

[ December 11, 2002, 17:11: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

[geoschmo]

SJ, as usual you blew my mind with that one.

I see what you mean now. 17% of 25% is 4.25%, so we had the same answer. What I don't see is how you got to 17% from 20% + 15%. But that's ok, maybe I don't want to know.

Geoschmo

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Ruatha:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pablo:
One is enough for the whole empire

Then the description in the build screen is wrong, there it says that it will convert resources made in the system.
I've built 10 of them in a game

---

Actually it doesn't. It does have the "(only 1 facility per system effective)" line in the ability description, which is kind of wierd I will admit. But it doesn't say anything anywhere about converting resources from that system only.

Geoschmo