sabot rounds on 7TP

[void1984]

I never heard of any special AP ammunition to Polish 37mm cannons in '39. Not to mention sabot rounds.

[DRG]

I've said it before, we've put it MOBHack on the weapons data page---------" NB-- Sabot is simply a second AP type with different max range and/or AP value"------ and I have no doubt I'm still going to be saying this 5 years from now......... "sabot" ammo can be anything from real sabot to a different kind of regular AP ammo. It could represent a newer type of sabot round and the ammo in the AP column could represent an older type of sabot round if sabot was all that was issue as "AP". ( that would be applicable only in MBT )

The last DOS version of the Polish OOB the 7TP did NOT have "sabot" ammo. A year and a half later the first Windows version did. I'm fairly certain who it was who provided that info but he hasn't posted on the forums for quite some time and the prevailing wisdom now is this is wrong. OK , fair enough but all that's been offered is variations on " I've never heard of this".

It *could* have been that he had info on some experimental shells and added it in..... IDK..... if could be that it was simply a mistake but the entire ammo count changed so that's less likely. ....it could be he just made it up for fun but I find that even less likely so there was some basis for him adding a "more advanced" AP round for that gun and not only add it but add more of it after November 1938-----but IDK. I could and probably will take it out which means every scenario and campaign using a 7TP built since 2006 will show errors and have to be rebuilt.. but hey...... I do that every release anyway but the fact remains SOMETHING caused him to add this "more advanced AP round" and it's really too bad we can't hear what he has to say on the matter before I pull it out.


Don

[Pibwl]

We have several months to find out, I think. As I've said, I have never found any info on works on improved 37 mm AP rounds, while I'm interested in Polish armour for at least 25 years (and for 15 years I run a webpage about it), and I'm trying to track the news. Surely such ammo wasn't issued. Besides, there was no need for improved AP rounds, since standard round was enough to deal with all contemporary German and Soviet tanks (its performance was slightly better, then Pak-35/36). Penetration 8 is the same, as German tungsten APCR. Future Polish tanks were to be armed with 40-55 mm guns instead.

Michal

[DRG]

"Problem" solved. I contacted Blaz, the "sabot" has been removed.


Don

[PvtJoker]

Just a little comment on the French 37mm L21 gun (SA18):

The round you have modeled as sabot (AP Pen 3) was in fact one of the first service APCR rounds for tank guns. The original AP round for that gun was a naval design dated to the 1800s (basically a simple steel shot) and had a much lower penetration, something like 10-15 mm at 100 meters (90 degrees).

Many countries which purchased the FT-17 after WW1 did not get the improved French ammo. Finnish tests of the original AP ammo showed that it was incapable of penetrating 10 mm armor quality plate at 100 meters and was therefore nearly useless even against lightly armored vehicles. The French seem to have realized that some time in the 1930s and went for the best possible AP round they could design for that gun, since they had it on so many of their light tanks. Muzzle velocity was 600 m/s, which was pretty impressive for that gun.