Current game effects of thermobaric ammo

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Wdll

BTW, if you want to have some fun with the, get the russian mlrs that fires them. Shoot near enemy armour. Laughter. I found out about it in a recent game. Way overpowered.

The Tos graphics currently don't do the weapon justice because the weapon class is 9 whereas it should be 18 ( and is now ) like any other flame rocket and is an exceedingly nasty fuel-air weapon that fires a salvo of 30 missiles in anywhere from 7.5 -15 seconds depending on the source.

......" it fires a 220mm fuel-air explosive missile. This type of munition releases a large cloud of flammable gas and cause massive explosions that can clear out bunkers and other fortifications. "

......"it detonates, first creating a high temperature cloud of flame followed by a crushing overpressure."

It wouldn't do tanks any good either and it's already a very expensive weapon that's twice the cost of CM rockets

If you want to criticize the weapon stats, that's fine, but try doing it with actual data if you think it's "Way overpowered"


Don

[Suhiir]

I'm just a bit annoyed by the residual burning hex effects from the way FAE's are currently modeled in the game. It's not that big a deal, I was just thinking since they're really more of an explosion then a "real" flame attack they might possibly be modeled differently.
As I said, just brainstorming.

[Wdll]

Originally Posted by DRG

The Tos graphics currently don't do the weapon justice because the weapon class is 9 whereas it should be 18 ( and is now ) like any other flame rocket and is an exceedingly nasty fuel-air weapon that fires a salvo of 30 missiles in anywhere from 7.5 -15 seconds depending on the source.

It wouldn't do tanks any good either and it's already a very expensive weapon that's twice the cost of CM rockets

If you want to criticize the weapon stats, that's fine, but try doing it with actual data if you think it's "Way overpowered"


Don

It feels overpowered to me (and my opponent) the way a single shot from a weapon would feel if it would take out (as in 100% destroy) 4 Merkava 4s in one hit.
I have zero knowledge about the specific weapon so I do not comment on if it is overpowered in terms of not good translation reality--->game. So, I am not criticizing the way it is implemented in the game.

That doesn't change what I think about CM in the game, but that is a different matter so no point in talking about here I guess.

[Imp]

It feels overpowered to me (and my opponent) the way a single shot from a weapon would feel if it would take out (as in 100% destroy) 4 Merkava 4s in one hit.

As I said think you were lucky it will flaten IFVs 95% of the time but vs tanks nowhere near that effective, unharmed or light damage with heavy suppresion is common vs a MBT in my experience. Vs troops if anything might be more effective due to blanket effect, even if found cover somehow from the heat I would think there is no oxygen left to breath which is probably terminal.
Kartoffel worth a look at them in action on you tube, the old Tungunaska is a good view to. Also try typing in power sliding/drifting tanks or some such. Some great vids of guys messing on snow ice in MBT IFVs 60 Tons going sideways at 30 miles an hour is a bit mad, wonder what the battle computer would make of it.

[DRG]

Four tanks were concentrated at the centre of a cloud of highly explosive gas. What did you expect would happen ???

Don

[Wdll]

Sigh...I am not saying the unit is not implemented correctly in the game. I am saying it is too powerful for my (and opponents) taste and thus we don't use it any more.

Don't confuse my view on the CM artillery and the TOS-1.

[DRG]

The words you used were "Way overpowered" The concept of "my (and opponents) taste " didn't enter into the conversation until later .

I'm suggesting if you think it's overpowered then present me with some evidence to support that contention and I'll consider a change but we are dealing with a weapon that in real life turns an area 400 metres by 200 metres into the eye of a firestorm.

Don

[Mobhack]

Not only that, being thermobaric (Fuel-Air Explosive) it rips all the local oxygen right out of the air to fuel the explosion (The bomb provides the fuel cloud, the environment the air), and that includes any residing in the lungs of anyone unlucky to be caught in there too.

(In that it is somewhat similar to flame-throwers & napalm - the primary thing those did was to consume the limited air in a targeted bunker(or tank) to fuel the petroleum fire, and so asphyxiate the defenders or force them out into the flame seeking oxygen. Choke effect as much as toast.)

The FAE "explosion" does not happen at one point (like an HE shell) but happens all around the cloud of fuel the bomb had dispersed prior to the ignition event. Everything basically goes off at once, and you get multiple shock waves and debris coming from all angles, not just from the single point source of an HE explosion. If the grunts in the fuel cloud have breathed in any fuel droplets in the time before ignition, nasty.

Basically a manufactured version of a flour/grain elevator or coal-dust mine explosion, or a domestic gas leak.

Again flame-throwers can be used to 'roll your own FAE' - it was common practice in WW2 for Churchill Crocodiles to hose down a bunker with raw unlit fuel and let it soak in for a few seconds, to emit petroleum vapour which would pool in the enclosed spaces of the building as the fuel splashed about. Then fire a final live flame shot for a nice big WHUMP.

In Real Life - FAE are subject to atmospheric conditions (wind, rain, fog, etc) which can cause them to fizzle.

Cheers
Andy

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Suhiir

I'm just a bit annoyed by the residual burning hex effects from the way FAE's are currently modeled in the game. It's not that big a deal, I was just thinking since they're really more of an explosion then a "real" flame attack they might possibly be modeled differently.
As I said, just brainstorming.

OK, lets start with the weapons. Which ones specifically ? Give me a couple of examples. There are at least three ways a flame weapon could be modeled in the game so I need specifics not generalities

Don

[Imp]

Again flame-throwers can be used to 'roll your own FAE' - it was common practice in WW2 for Churchill Crocodiles to hose down a bunker with raw unlit fuel and let it soak in for a few seconds, to emit petroleum vapour which would pool in the enclosed spaces of the building as the fuel splashed about. Then fire a final live flame shot for a nice big WHUMP.

Jez what a way to go, you get a couple of seconds to realise you are about to become toast.