Guide: Does starting or current Max dominion determine temple checks?

[vfb]

Great plan with the 2 province ... island? Alternate plane of reality?

I didn't want to make 25 temples because I thought I'd get temple dom spread halfway across the map, but with 2 isolated provinces, it shouldn't be an issue.

I was worried that when using dom1 and dom2, that dom1 might get lucky and put candle up in the dom2 province, and the RNG would fail to blow it out, leading to massive dom spread by the dom1 nation. dom10 and dom5+5 is a much better bet.

[MaxWilson]

The Dom 5 + 25 temples sounds like a good plan. Calmon did something similar and posted it in the bug thread, quoted by UncleYee here:

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showt...mon#post505528

-Max

[vfb]

I created two nations and teleported the prophets to an unconnected island of 4 provinces. The prophets did not preach.

Prophet test:

Candles in 4-province island, results at turn:

Turn  Dom10@start  Dom5,25 temples
====  ===========  ===============
3     1            1
4     2            2
5     2            2
6     2            2
7     3            3
8     2            2
9     2            2
10    2            2
...
20    4            3
...
30    7            6
...
40    8            6

But, at 40 turns, 4 temples had been lost to random events, so it was actually dom5, 21 temples. It's not a 2-to-1 advantage in any case.


I then tested teleporting the Gods into the island instead of the prophets:

God test:

Candles in 4-province island, results at turn:

Turn  Dom10@start  Dom5,25 temples
====  ===========  ===============
13     1            1
14     4            2 (oops, 24 temples)
15     4            2 (back to 25 temples)
16     5            3
17     7            5
18     7            5
19     8            6
20     9            7
...
30     11           8 
...
40     11           8
...
50     10           8
...
60     11           9

Start without the 25 temples:

Turn  Dom10@start  Dom5,1 temples
====  ===========  ===============
9     2            1 
10    3            1
11    4            0
12    5            0
13    7            0
14    9            1
15    10           0
16    12           0
17    13           0
...
20    18           0
...
30    36           0

Anyway, that's good enough evidence for me I think.

(I started Arco with a dom-5 god and Ermor dom-10, indies at 0, uncommon events, on the attached map.)

[vfb]

More testing ... dom spread for juggernauts is based on starting dominion.

I created a map with 2 2-province islands, so there would be no competing dom spread, and into one island sent a prophet from the dom5 nation, into the other island send a juggernaut from the dom5 nation.

At turn 20:

Prophet island: 18 candles
Juggernaut island: 7 candles.

With the starting-dom10 nation:

Prophet island: 18 candles
Juggernaut island: 18 candles.

[vfb]

I tried testing Victory points but it's harder to tell what's going on with the RNG. Probably need bigger islands to test on, especially for testing VP dom spread for a dom-1 nation. It doesn't look to me like temple count makes a difference to dom spread from VPs. I ran a few repeat tests.

Dom-10 nation with spread from a victory point only

Turn   Candles (2-prov island)
10     5      5
20     10     11
30     17     17

Dom-5 nation with 25 temples (none on island) spread from a victory point only

Turn   Candles (2-prov island)
10     4       1      6     5    2
20     9       4     12    12    5
30     13     10     16    18    8

Dom-5 nation with 1 temples (none on island) spread from a victory point only

Turn   Candles (2-prov island)
10     4      4     2
20     6     10     5
30     9    (max)  10

One item of note is that VPs and Juggernauts do spread dominion for EA Mictlan.

[Dragar]

Thanks heaps for that testing vfb, good to have it clear finally

[MaxWilson]

Originally Posted by vfb

Anyway, that's good enough evidence for me I think.

(I started Arco with a dom-5 god and Ermor dom-10, indies at 0, uncommon events, on the attached map.)

So combining your results with Calmon's, I think that's conclusive and KO is right: temple checks from temples are based on start dominion, temple checks from god and prophet are based on current dominion. (And temple checks from juggernauts are also based on start dominion.)

-Max

[Micah]

The really important question still remains though: how about blood saccing? That's probably the easiest way to spread dominion in a hurry, juggs being a weak second for those that can do either. (Because really, the extra candle and a half you're getting from prophet/god isn't mattering much when you have 25 temples, though it's a great trivia question.) Any chance you can fire up your map when you get another chance and check that out VFB?

And thanks for testing!

[chrispedersen]

It might also be interesting to test LA-R Prophets.

[vfb]

Oh no.

Here's what I did to test, first with a Dom-10 god:

Turn 1: Teleported (gate stone) a priest (not a prophet) to the 2-province "island"

dom in island (after running turn): 0

Turn 2: Build a temple in province, teleport 8 slaves to the province

dom in island: 0

Turn 3: Sacrifice 1 slave

dom in island: 2! Gah. That's impossible, supposedly.

Turn 4: Sacrifice 1 slave

dom in island: 4 (+2 again!) But this time I saved the turn before running it, so I've got evidence.

Turn 5: Sacrifice 1 slave (H1 priest this time, before it was an H4)

dom in island: 6.

Well, that's just goofy. Every turn I've sacrificed, I'm getting +2 candles in the island. EA Mictlan temples are not supposed to spread dominion, right? I will take a turn off sacrificing and see if I get dom spread. I'm running CBM1.5, but that shouldn't make a difference.

Turn 6: No sacrifice.

And ... 6 candles. No change.

Turn 7: No sacrifice.

And ... 6 candles. No change. I'll go back to sacrificing, 1 virgin:

Turn 8: 1 sacrifice.

And ... 8 candles. Well, that's enough of that. I'll sacrifice 4 slaves at the temple with an H4 priest.

Turn 9: 4 sacrifices.

And ... 17 candles. +8. Plus I got a "festival" event for +1. Stupid events!

I'll test with a starting dom of 9 and no extra temples next, then 5 and no temples. then 5 and 25 temples.