Dom-III discussion at GalCiv - Page 2

DominionsFan · #11 August 29th, 2006, 06:26 PM

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quantum_mechani said:
Even somewhat negative discussion is a lot better than the absolutely zero response I have gotten posting about dom3 on Apolyton...

Odd, civ fans dont know about Doms?

Frostmourne27 · #12 August 29th, 2006, 08:32 PM

I'm interested in that the GalCiv ppl seem to be mostly complaining about price / value / worth. I have to say that I don't really fall into the 'niche' gamer box... I don't think. I play big name titles, (even if i hat EA) and I fork out a fair bit of money for games. I bought Dom2 about a year ago, though only after playing the demo for quite some time. I found the biggest obstacle was ordering online, not the price. Seriously, I don't really think that Dominions isn't polished, and don't really see why it should be cheaper than any other game. Computer game price is really wacked IMHO. Dom3 should be cheaper because Illwinter is smaller? Big name games should be expensive even though most of them REALLY REALLY suck? Galciv may be an interesting game, I've never played it. Supposedly doesn't the combat system really stink? I've been told that all the ships on one side fire at the same target, and that it just goes back and forth, and you can screw with AI targeting by playing with firepower/size/hp ratios... though that might not be true. still, from what they were saying, I think a lot of them might be interested if the price were only a little lower, so its not too bad. I won't mention what i think should happen to the guy who advocated a $20 price tag though...

baby_arm · #13 August 29th, 2006, 08:39 PM

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we're very appreciative that Brad started a thread about Dom 3 on his forums.

And had it on the front page no less. It's also worth noting what he wrote further in the thread:

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I think Domininions 2 is the best fantasy strategy game that has ever been made. It has depth, it has expandability. And while some may not like the graphics, the entire game is easily moddable and third parties have made some incredibly cool stuff for it.

I have no doubt that Dominions 3 will be the same sort of thing. It's a great game.

I also am very certain that there is a significant subset of GalCiv II players who are likely to enjoy Dominions just as I think there's a lot of Dominions players who are likely to enjoy GalCiv.

But more to the point -- we're all on the same side here. Shrapnel and co. are our kind of people. We should do what we can to support them. The world is a better place with games like Dominions.

If fantasy strategy or hard core strategy games like Dominions aren't your cup of tea, that's fine. But I think it's a great game and the people who make it and the community around it is wonderful IMO.

edit: That's the best sort of endorsement I could imagine. I wonder what Sid Meier thinks of Dominions...

Gandalf Parker · #14 August 29th, 2006, 08:47 PM

Wow thats really cool. Ive always thought alot of brad but thats moved up another notch in my opinion.

Archonsod · #15 August 29th, 2006, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Morkilus said:
I've run across some game-breaking retardedness in the GC2 campaign AI, such as enemy ships being built without weapons.

That's not retarded. The idea is to upgrade the design to one with weapons as soon as they become available . In the meantime, the ship will prevent you from invading a planet with a transport, unless you send warships in.I've even seen the AI build most of their fleet weaponless, only to upgrade when my ships were about to attack (thus rendering my carefully chosen armour useless against the lasers I never knew they had...).

Thing is, Dominions 2 doesn't really need a decent AI to make the game playable (and that's from someone who prefers single player over multiplayer). Remove the AI opponents from Dominions and you still have an intricate, detailed and fun game which plays differently everytime. Remove the AI from Gal Civ, and you no longer have a game. It's all about focus - Dominions' strength lies in it's depth and complexity. Gal Civ focuses more on the competition.

Tyrant · #16 August 30th, 2006, 03:01 AM

Interesting that they brought up MoM. When i'm proselatizing for DomII I always try to explain it as "Masters of Magic meets VGAP," but so far not one single person has known what i was talking about. I loved MoM, and always hoped they'd do an MP sequel. They didn't, but Illwinter stepped up to the plate and hit a homer.

As for he AI, <shrug>, who cares? Nearly all 'puter strategy games are SP. If they have MP at all it's an afterthought pasted onto a game system that's ill suited for it. Often games last hundreds of turns, or one strategy is clearly superior. Dom is a rare strategy game that's made for MP from the ground up. If i want to play an SP games and "solve" AIs there are hundreds to choose from. Dom is the best strategic MP game i've found by far, and I'd buy Dom3 even if it didn't have an AI at all.

That said, I'm confidently hoping the new AI will be better :>. I'm also pretty confident that after X games i will be able to crush it reliably.

PDF · #17 August 30th, 2006, 11:06 AM

Just posted my views at GC2

JaydedOne · #18 August 30th, 2006, 11:19 AM

Brad said:

Quote:

I think Domininions 2 is the best fantasy strategy game that has ever been made. It has depth, it has expandability. And while some may not like the graphics, the entire game is easily moddable and third parties have made some incredibly cool stuff for it.

I have no doubt that Dominions 3 will be the same sort of thing. It's a great game.

I also am very certain that there is a significant subset of GalCiv II players who are likely to enjoy Dominions just as I think there's a lot of Dominions players who are likely to enjoy GalCiv.

But more to the point -- we're all on the same side here. Shrapnel and co. are our kind of people. We should do what we can to support them. The world is a better place with games like Dominions.

If fantasy strategy or hard core strategy games like Dominions aren't your cup of tea, that's fine. But I think it's a great game and the people who make it and the community around it is wonderful IMO.

A class act indeed. Not many devs would glow like this about another dev's product, especially when Stardock has long been rumored to be interested in eventually following up on Master of Magic.

But he's right about the fact that these are exactly the games that the community needs to support. I bought both GalCiv 2 and Dom2 because of the fact that they were obviously works built with heart by smaller developers and released against odds in a market that's becoming more and more consolidated and accordingly less willing to challenge thinking gamers. Both games have a number of wrinkles that are easy to point out; but you'd expect that given the fact that they don't have a paid full-time QA team, to say nothing of the inability to pump tons of money into development of graphics, AI, etc. Frankly, I'm thrilled that they're as fantastic as they are and when I ask for improvements, it's with a deep respect for everything accomplished thus far.

DominionsFan · #19 August 30th, 2006, 11:36 AM

Yeah it was a very nice thing from Brad to post news like this about Doms 3.
Oh btw it seems that Brad is visiting these forums. ->

"..But I think it's a great game and the people who make it and the community around it is wonderful IMO..".

BigJMoney · #20 September 2nd, 2006, 11:01 PM

Very, very well put, Archon. I've noticed in many games with strong AI that players confuse good AI for poor AI when it's actually the AI doing something intelligent without the player realizing it. I remember this happening some in Black & White. I've heard numerous tales of designers crafting AI systems that seem to be misbehaving, but then find out later that the AI is actually getting something done in a way the developer never thought of. I'm sure even the largely disappointing Radiant AI of Oblivion achieves this sometimes.

=$= Big J Money =$=