A pirates life for me...

[WhiteHojo]

Spyder - I believe you are thinking along the same lines as me. I was hoping to be able to build a race for the AI to run that would be rather annoying and fun to play against. like a cross b/t a neutral and the EA.

As the race is taking shape, w/o the ability to research and expand rapidly, I agree that they would not be able to win the game - at some point they would collapse in on themselves (no one readily availble to capture and plunder = no more growth). However, I believe they would be as viable a race even w/o the realistic ability to win the game as most of the other so called active AI empires. (always seems to be just 7 or so AI empires that always seem to be near the top in most games)

I like the idea of givin em some advanced techs early (kinda offsets the low research rate)... maybe both Resource Manipulation facilities (ulta-recycler & resource converter - max levels?)... maybe ship and fleet training techs... start out w/Light Cruiser hulls & repair tech???

my concern would be to in makin em too powerful right off the bat - but remember that it will be the AI using them, not a human - so not as much chance of takin advantage of the advances.

Also, if you did give em more advanced tech at start, the penalty to their research would have to be rather drastic (-50% is the max)

I am still concerned over the effect the higher maintanence cost would have on the races ability to field a respectable sized fleet... more argument is welcome.

taking all the ideas in so far, the latest Version of the Corsair's traits:

removed Hardy Industrialists - joining the capture more/build less ranks

-50% to Research
+10% to Intell
-9% to reproduction
+25% to Ship Attack
+20% to ship Def
-30% to trade
-15% to all resources
+20% to repair rate

all other traits stay at default 100%

Wanted to boost the ground combat up by 20% but then I remembered that I've never seen the AI try, let alone capture, a planet via ground combat...

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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[This message has been edited by WhiteHojo (edited 01 March 2001).]

[Sinapus]

Okay, but only if someone with a lot of familiarity with Gilbert and Sullivan do the speech file.



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"What do -you- want?" "I'd like to live -just- long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next ten generations that some favors come with too high a price. I would look up into your lifeless eyes and wave like this..." *waggle* "...can you and your associates arrange that for me, Mr. Morden?"

[Suicide Junkie]

I had a bunch of good ideas while posting in the Nomadic Thread.

It would be possible to force the race to live without planetary support, by preventing colonization tech, and minimizing the returns from planets. With zero maintenance, they can survive without a planet, and grow by capturing ships and tech.

In fact, they'd be very virus/borg-like, assimilating all they can, and then upgrading the ships to capture more ships.

In fact, if you give them zero maintenance, then they do have a chance to win the game.

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As soon as exams are over, I'm gonna design a race like that, 0 maintenance, and max negative planetary traits, with no colonization tech allowed.

You'll start with a planet, and use that to build SYS's which will hide out from the AI, and scavenge crippled ships for survival.

Underdog victories, with a hint of desperation, and tons of sneakiness, oh Yeah!

[WhiteHojo]

w/a 0 maintenance though, they would be more cancer like than pirate like. Imagine the horror - a race w/no maintenance cost shows up in your systems w/ship capturing tech and a mean disposition - you send out a fleet to stop em, WHAM - they are now turned against you - you send more - oops - those also. Not sure I'd like where that is heading.



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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[Suicide Junkie]

That situation can be easily defended against by having mines/sats/fighters which can't be captured.

Your ships would already be heavily shielded, and you would likely add self destruct if you knew pirates were in the area.

You could always ram if your shields are about to fail, and security stations work well too.

Besides, If ship capture tech was so dangerous, why do you run around with phased polaron beams and WMGs, when you could just have a fleet o ship capture tech & a space yard to scrap what you can't support?

The pirates will have to do hit-and-run tactics on your lightly defended colonies and solo ships.

Anything you lose, you can replace.
Anything Pirates lose, they've lost for good.

So, in a straight out fight, the pirates will be crushed. The pirates have to completely win blowout battles, if they hope to capture more than they lose. You, on the other hand, can build more ships and fight back after losses.

[dmm]

Invading pirates could be defeated with fighters, which can't be boarded. Or maybe just surround your fleet with fighters, so the pirates can't get close enough to board.

By the way, can fighter Groups be rammed?

[dmm]

Hey, suicide_junkie, great minds think alike.

[dmm]

Maybe pirates should be Psychic, so they can keep going in the later game.

[WhiteHojo]

Try to play a game using ship capturing tech - it's alot easier than it seems once you get past the ridiculously high research cost to attain Ship Capture tech. (once got it very early in a game via ruins - made the game rather easy after that) PPBs are good - very good in fact but only till the other side gets 2nd gen phased shields then they're just as effective as any other wpn.

the self destruct device is a rather tough obstecle to overcome but w/the new fleet option allowing destroying a ship till X% of it is disabled it might be more feasable to combat against.

I just hate mines but you're right about the fighters and mines being a good counter - untill you run into PD-Vs - then it gets a little tougher.

However, another thought accured to me for the little pirate race - fighters should be involved somehow - no maintenance fee and they're cheap to build. Send in the Fighters to soften up the fleet then follow w/a wave of ship capture. Ideas.


EDIT - that 1st line sounds rather tacky and rude - didn't mean it to sound that way - sorry
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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[This message has been edited by WhiteHojo (edited 01 March 2001).]

[Suicide Junkie]

Yeah, fighters can (and should) be rammed.

They have almost no hitpoints, so you can bump piles of em out of the way provided you have some heavy armor.


Yeah, in summary:

- Ship capture tech is easily beaten by non-capturable units.
- Pirates lose in big Fleet-to-Fleet confrontations, since they must capture to recover losses.


Additional:
Fleet situations make capturing dangerous, since the boarding ship loses ALL shielding, and the captured ship has no shields.
Any remaining Loyal ships, now have the opportunity to take out two defenceless enemy ships.

Plus: Boarding parties must be repaired after capturing. SOooo, Once the pirates have all they can carry, they'll be heading off into deep space again, hoping you won't follow.