No more MP for Hinnom? - Page 19

DonCorazon · #**181** November 18th, 2008, 11:40 PM

Max, Just to be clear, I am not trying to compare Ashdod to Niefelheim or debate strategy. I am trying to address the thread topic/survey on how these nations impact MP games.

I think the difference in power between Ashdod and other nations in MA is fairly extreme. Not necessarily saying they should be banned, or even nerfed, but it seems most of the focus has been on Hinnom. I think that Ashdod is actually currently more unbalanced relative to its peers.

Alderanas · #**182** November 19th, 2008, 01:04 AM

Shouldnt they be a powerful scary nation. I mean after-all they are cannibalistic giants who fallen angels taught how to fight. You should also add the option to keep them in mp.

MaxWilson · #**183** November 19th, 2008, 01:50 AM

Ashdod is not cannibalistic, in case you were talking about them and not Hinnom. I thought I was agreeing with you, DonCorazon--saying that a nation is "less powerful than Niefelheim early on" is sort of like saying that a guy is "a little weaker than Mr. T." Not exactly a charge of weakness, y'know? The point is that Ashdod just gets better with time.

Ashdod is by far the strongest nation I've seen, all things considered. Or maybe they just suit my playstyle the best, I dunno. (Marverni and LA Agartha are also great.)

-Max

AreaOfEffect · #**184** November 19th, 2008, 12:26 PM

I'm playing against a double bless Ashdod in a MA game currently. I'm playing a double bless Mictlan. Knowing how cheap my sacreds are, I would say that, dollar for dollar, the Ashdod sacreds win almost 3 dollars to my 1 in a straight up fight. This includes the use of jade amazon riders. I'm serious, nearly hundreds to his dozens. I'm actually glad I didn't take a full fire bless as that might work more in Ashdod's favor, considering their natural fire resistance. Luckily for me, I would never fight a straight up fight against them.

Their access to death magic has been painfully synergistic. Their skelly spam is better then any other nations due to their unique undead. I think their access to forgers and earth magic also synergies too well with their access to national thugs.

As for player skill, the original player knew what he was doing. It is now controlled by a new player. That said, he has still managed to fend off three nations and eat another one alive. It is a bit ridiculous, but I suspect the gap in player skill might allow the others and I victory. Against an experienced player, I would say we have no chance to survive.

JimMorrison · #**185** November 19th, 2008, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect

As for player skill, the original player knew what he was doing. It is now controlled by a new player. That said, he has still managed to fend off three nations and eat another one alive. It is a bit ridiculous, but I suspect the gap in player skill might allow the others and I victory. Against an experienced player, I would say we have no chance to survive.

Calahan was really a great player, and a great guy. Hope he's doing as well with whatever RL threw at him, as he was doing here with Ashdod.

PS - I think they're a bit over the top myself. I guess I should run a good test game so I can comment in actual detail.....

MaxWilson · #**186** November 20th, 2008, 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect

Their access to death magic has been painfully synergistic. Their skelly spam is better then any other nations due to their unique undead. I think their access to forgers and earth magic also synergies too well with their access to national thugs.

15% Forge Bonus on Talmai Elders + Dwarven Hammers + 3 misc slot sacred giants w/ magic = really nice thugs.

-Max

vfb · #**187** November 20th, 2008, 03:11 AM

This works to a lesser extent with Gath too. A Forge Lord with an E9F4 gives a nice enough bless to the super-cheap recruit-anywhere zealots, and pretty good scales.

He makes extremely cheap hammers for himself and the rest of the Gath mages to build items for the 3-misc-slot Gadols, and inexpensive Serens. Get a nice heroic ability, and you're in SC land.

MaxWilson · #**188** November 21st, 2008, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect

Their access to death magic has been painfully synergistic. Their skelly spam is better then any other nations due to their unique undead.

Thinking about this more... is Ashdod spam actually better? Typically it seems that you get either 5 regular skellies or 1 giant skelly (or maybe 1 giant and 1 normal). I don't think 10 giant skellies are actually better than 50 regular skellies except maybe against heavily-armored troops. (Troop density is worse and you have less overall attacking power.)

-Max

JimMorrison · #**189** November 22nd, 2008, 12:01 AM

From everything that I've seen, there is no reduction in quantity. Nation specific undead are simply added to the "spawn list". This is most clear with Lanka priests Reanimating, as they can get large numbers of Soulless Bandar, which are quite nice.

(EDIT - Just rewatched a current Ashdod fight, with a single skelly spammer. First cast, 5 Longdead. Second cast, 4 Longdead + 1 Longdead Rephaite.)

vfb · #**190** November 22nd, 2008, 04:44 AM

Same here Jim. I've never seen less undead reanimate either in battle or overland, just because some of the undead is special (giant or otherwise).