Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running - Page 11

Thanatus del Dragos · #**101** February 10th, 2011, 03:34 PM

I would say, that we need to plan for Atlantis, but we should not venture into the sea until we have contained the other land AIs. Right now they are an enemy of our enemies, and that makes them our friend. I plan on knocking them back into the sea when I see them on land, but I'm not going to divide resources between chasing them into the sea, (which would be an expensive venture for me), until I have secured my position versus Tian Chi.

Hrum · #**102** February 10th, 2011, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatus del Dragos

I would say, that we need to plan for Atlantis, but we should not venture into the sea until we have contained the other land AIs. Right now they are an enemy of our enemies, and that makes them our friend. I plan on knocking them back into the sea when I see them on land, but I'm not going to divide resources between chasing them into the sea, (which would be an expensive venture for me), until I have secured my position versus Tian Chi.

One thing of note: In my experience the AI tends to take it as a declaration of war if you take a province from them. I don't think the AI understands the idea of a limited engagement / regional conflict. If you take a land province from Atlantis, you'll probably find yourself at war with that AI, who will attack all up and down the coast. If you do this too early, you may be the only nation he's at war with. Granted, he might still pick a fight with you anyway, even if you don't take provinces from him, but if you do I think it's a near certainty.

BTW, re: Trolls, I finally got around to installing the Debug mod, and it's quite useful. Out of curiousity, I tried to model your fight with the Trolls, based on what you've said here about your bless, and using a standard summoned troop of trolls as the OpFor (2 Moosen Trolls, 5 War Trolls & 10 Trolls).

Good news: It looks like 19+ Unmarked (plus a handful of furbolg) can take the trolls, but not without a few losses.

Bad news: A dozen or so Unmarked cannot take the trolls - Unmarked got stomped.

The trolls, it turns out, are really buff (any veterans reading this are probably laughing at my awesome statement of the obvious). The part I forgot about earlier was the protection. The lesser, "crappier" trolls have prot 15 (on the body, don't recall what's on the head) - that's pretty tough for a high hitpoint, regenerating opponent. The buffer ones (the War Trolls, and Moosen) have prot 23!! Zoinks! Your dudes with their Str20 and Dmg3 spears are only doing ~23 damage (+/- due to contested DRN). Umm, Houston we have a problem.

Also, while your dudes have some reinvig thanks to your E4 bless, your dudes still pick up fatigue faster than the trolls in my tests. Since no side claimed victory (or even a significant advantage) in the first round or two, it became a grind, and after a few rounds fatigue starts to come into play. Fatigue means crits, which (especially against high damage dudes like Trolls) means dead Unmarked. Unmarked get some crits in on the Trolls too, but it's a huge grind, with attrition being the deciding factor, so the side with numerical superiority will probably win.

Conclusion: Overwhelming force, or buffs / evocations are probably a good idea for this fight.

Thanatus del Dragos · #**103** February 10th, 2011, 06:14 PM

Giants. I need some Giants for this.

Mauxe · #**104** February 10th, 2011, 07:32 PM

I have been slow to get things back in order after my power went out but I'm reconnecting now.

I am sitting mostly pretty in the NE corner of the map slowly building up 3 elephant/archer armies. I've taken a few provinces but I just realized that the river here has blocked my progress. Lizardmen and Mammoths ahead... unfortunately option #2 is a defended Ramparts...

Option #3 takes me along the northern border of the map. I'll head that way soon but for the moment I am bringing 2 forces together to wipe out the lizards in order to bypass the Ramparts for now.

My pretender is a dormant rainbow crone...I think. I may haave opted for a mage before realizing that the riding pretender mage does not have a foot slot

My strategy is to expand with military for a brief time until I have enough income to support a hastened research path. Forts and site-searching for another short bit with a bit of forging thrown in. A few key items that I am shooting for and I will be much better equipped to explode outward.

Of course... the AI may have other things to say about that.

Doo · #**105** February 11th, 2011, 03:27 AM

I'm back and have played my turns.

Sitting at 5 provinces so far. I aim to start building my second castle either next turn or the one after that.

Thanatus del Dragos · #**106** February 11th, 2011, 09:08 AM

Damn Doo, you are way ahead of me, I've only got 3 provinces, but I have issues. Taking on the Draco Lion this next turn, wish me luck.

endomorphious · #**107** February 11th, 2011, 09:40 AM

Just finished my turn. Have 4 provinces besides my capital. But, money is SCARCE :{ I've got 3 of the sites searched with 4F/4E/4D/1W/1N/4Priest and only found 1 site so far but its an ok one with 1 air gem and 1 fire gem. I took that single lake by me. Big mistake. It has like zip for income and only one troop to recruit but its a 9000gp modded indy...arggh...maybe I'll find a free fortress in there if I can ever spare a site searcher. Just now seeing signs of Jotunheim nearby looks like he'll be my first conflict down the road. How effective is skellispam against the giants? I dont think my nationals are gonna be up to stomping them in the numbers I can field.

Hrum · #**108** February 11th, 2011, 02:52 PM

I gotta build me a fort too. Always so many things to spend the gold on... :P

Thanatus, I checked it's stats on the DB and I think you'll take that Draco Lion, assuming it isn't backed up by a surprise bunch of ?

Mauxe, once you hit evo2, are you thinking of doing the shock wave thing with your Eagle Kings? I've heard that some people like that as an expansion method with EA Caelum.

I don't how well skellispam will work on the giants. I've never tried skellispamming before.

Sounds like my expansion is in the same neighborhood as the rest of you (4 provs so far). Monkey arrow catchers have low morale and like to run off, even during a winning fight. It's par for the course, but it slows down expansion. And then there's me being cautious because of the random crazy stuff in some of these provinces. Of course, I did score some decent magic items off these guys already (earth boots, dusk dagger, shroud).

I'm doing an attack on a province w/ ~20 Ko-Oni this turn, and I'm going in without any blockers/arrow catchers. Just my Yavana flying solo (backed up by my prophet). I wasn't sure about the Yavana vs. Ko-Oni matchup so I ran a test w/ Debug Mod and All Ages Mod, and it turns out my blessed Yavana pretty much destroy Ko-Oni, so this should go fine (*finger crossed*). Of course I didn't do the scout / retreat routine beforehand, so hopefully there isn't some super scary surprise in addition to the Ko-Oni.

In other news, I need more scouts. I don't have a solid idea on how fast the AIs (specifically Niefelheim) are expanding. Lack of graphs can lead to blissful ignorance, or nail-biting depending on your temperament.

endomorphious · #**109** February 11th, 2011, 03:13 PM

I agree. I am worried about how fast the AI's are expanding as well. I hope their running up against the tough indie's as well or things could get ugly fast. Deep down I just know the giants near me already have 12 provinces and they all have gold mines and amazons. But, then I'm an optimist.

Thanatus del Dragos · #**110** February 11th, 2011, 04:51 PM

Only lost one Firbolg against the Draco Lion. I've decioded to not fight the Trolls right now and turn the army north. I think the losses even if I won would be crippling right now. I am going to wait until I research a bit more and can shock their asses and have a good amount of giants to thump them.