Star Trek, Quadrants of Conflict

[Atrocities]

If I had $.02, I'd spend it.

[Atrocities]

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...35113?v=glance
You had better hurry while supplies Last. I have one and they are quite cool.

I have the following
Enterprise (TOS)
Enterprise A
Enterprise D
BOP
D7 (TOS)
Romulan Warbird (TOS)

Very very cool.

[BlackRose]

Originally posted by alarikf:
I'm getting a bit confused here...with all these settings, are they going to be turned off in the game setup so we don;t have to worry about "accidentally" using/doing/researching one?

I mean, that's a lot of intel limitations, but unless it's turned off in the game setup, I can *totally* see myself not rememreing them. I'm in a number of games, and, well, I don't have a superb memory...

Also, I'd like to question the utility of setting artifical limitations on what empires can do with intel. I myself don;t use it much if at all, but, well, it;s hard to think of a good reason why the klingsons are liited to counter-intel 2 while other s can go higher...after all, you can;t force people to role-play and, well, there should be some sense of "what if," no?

just my $.02

thanks,

Alarik

(and I remain a belevier in having someone make a quickie map up so we don;t all have the "ancient race" trait...it's really easy to make a map with the game, then save it, and then very slightly modify it to change system names and place players and delete a few warp points to get the borg and 8472 to fight, etc...)

Well I think that was the game that Intimidator wanted when he called for players, was a as realistic as posible trek universe, one which Klingons were not known for thier sabatoge/espionage prowess Same goes for the map. As far the intel goes I was just going on my opinions re trek, taking into account intel operations vs Klingons which we knew to be successful also minding that certain races nothing materialized, ie Tholians, Breen, Dominion etc. Its not totally balanced but in a way it is As far as the rules go all you ahve to remember is Counter Intel lvls 1 and 2 and your set

[Intimidator]

Okay I'm back Online again. It's a pitty that I life 7 hours later than the most of you, so comms. are a bit slow. But I have done my reading again, so here are my comments:

Alarikf: I understand your problems with Intel, but as BlackRose said it is his view on Star Trek Intel (which I share). If you think that you (the Klingons) should have another Intel-ops. Let me know. And the only thing you have to do to remember is stick a note on your monitor with 'Klingon: counter Intel 1-2 only'

BlackRose: I want everybody to be free in Trade and Trade & Research Treaties, but are hoping that all of us keep remembering their Trek-Role (example: Dominion will not trade a lot,they are too arrogant to want other people's rescources and Klingons aren't famous about their research capabilites so an trade & research treaty will not be common etc etc....)

Renegade 13: As soon as everybody signed up I can change the starting points in the map according to pbw-player-setup or something like that. If there is another way please let me know !!

Tnarg: I read your mail, will you contact asap!

Intimidator,


BUT I STILL WANT PLAYERS. FERENGI, Nausicaan, Gorn, Hirogen, Vaadwaur.... or even you want Trill, Betazoid, Mintaken or even the f**king Bandi it's all up to you.....................

[ April 12, 2004, 11:42: Message edited by: Intimidator ]

[AMF]

Well, it's not so much that I feel that the Klingons should have more counter-intel levels (although I do) it's just that I find it strange to "guide" the role playing. Takes away the "what if." And there is the fact that the stock klingon race has bonuses to intelligence, so, they're good at it..but they can't do counter-intel level 3?

Anyways, really, I', not complaining about the klingons. I just prefer the "self-organizing" role playing that occurs rather than trying to guide people into taking the expected "canon" actions.

I remain concerned about using the stock map. Really, it's easy to generate a map and then, in 30 minutes, modify it so you get the same effect...

but I'll shut up now and wait for the game to start...

thanks!

Alarik

Originally posted by Intimidator:
Okay I'm back Online again. It's a pitty that I life 7 hours later than the most of you, so comms. are a bit slow. But I have done my reading again, so here are my comments:

Alarikf: I understand your problems with Intel, but as BlackRose said it is his view on Star Trek Intel (which I share). If you think that you (the Klingons) should have another Intel-ops. Let me know. And the only thing you have to do to remember is stick a note on your monitor with 'Klingon: counter Intel 1-2 only'

BlackRose: I want everybody to be free in Trade and Trade & Research Treaties, but are hoping that all of us keep remembering their Trek-Role (example: Dominion will not trade a lot,they are too arrogant to want other people's rescources and Klingons aren't famous about their research capabilites so an trade & research treaty will not be common etc etc....)

Renegade 13: As soon as everybody signed up I can change the starting points in the map according to pbw-player-setup or something like that. If there is another way please let me know !!

Tnarg: I read your mail, will you contact asap!

Intimidator,


BUT I STILL WANT PLAYERS. FERENGI, Nausicaan, Gorn, Hirogen, Vaadwaur.... or even you want Trill, Betazoid, Mintaken or even the f**king Bandi it's all up to you.....................

[AMF]

Ah, Ok, I lied, not quite shutting up. I just read your statement below to Renegade 13. The map thing is easy to do. There are really only a few characteristics of the stock trek map that are easily replicated. These are along the lines of: feds, klingons, and romulans are relatively close. Dominion is distant, and has a long distance wp connected to them - which terminates closer to the Cardassian region. Borg and 8472 are close to each other. and each race's homeworld has a specific name.

So, what one could do is start a trek game and generate a large paradise type map with 255 systems. Save that map. It will be very similar to the basic map, just without the above modifications.

Then, place the players starting positions as above. Rename their home systems. add a long distance WP that ends up close to the dominions and cardassia. delete a few wps to force the borg and 8472 to force them to compete for resources and warp lines. Voila! Map is done. Save it, and start the game, just making sure that people join (or are assigned) in the proper order to ensure that they end up in their homesystems (it would be weird for the klingons to end up in Sol, no?)

You know, if you want, I can bow out of the game and make this map in a jiffy. I could stay in, if you wanted - even after making the map - but then people would have to trust me that I didn't look at it (I wouldn't!)...

Ok, now, I really am shutting up.

thanks,

Alarik

Originally posted by Intimidator:

Renegade 13: As soon as everybody signed up I can change the starting points in the map according to pbw-player-setup or something like that. If there is another way please let me know !!

[Renegade 13]

Originally posted by Intimidator:
Renegade 13: As soon as everybody signed up I can change the starting points in the map according to pbw-player-setup or something like that. If there is another way please let me know !!

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:

quote:

---

Are we all going to have to join the game in a specific order to be able to get the starting positions correct?

Yes. The game host can assign all players to the empire slots on PBW in order instead, as long as he has the exact player account names of all players.

---

All I know about starting positions is what Fyron told me in the above reply to my original question. I don't exactly know what he means, but I've never created a game before only joined, so....that's about all I can say about that.

And Alarikf, I think its fine leaving the map as is, because sooner or later, because of partnerships, or map trades etc, everyone will know almost all of the map anyways. So as long as no one player has knowledge of the map that the other players don't, there's really no reason why everyone couldn't know what it is beforehand is there? Besides the obvious aspect of exploration which is kinda fun. Or am I missing something here?

[ April 12, 2004, 15:42: Message edited by: Renegade 13 ]

[Heretic]

Hi!
So my students are connected to some really tough stones!
Now i have time to do some chatting here. I want to say some points about intel and the federation. I do agree that they do not have the desire, out of the philisophy of ufp, to make some agresive intel actions. embassy taps, comm taps and perhaps census theft and the one projects concerning spying on plaets and ships i think would be the best for the federration to use. But i strongly object that federation intelligence is only capable of counter intel I.
In kirk�s time there is to be named
"operation dixie" which succsessfully penetrated klingon space and spied on the klingon navy and facilities. This is the most important operations to save federation butt in the seven yeaqrs war( okay perhaps a bit before kirk came). The federation maintains along the borders of the neutral zone some advanced sensor phalanxes with extensive intel capabilities. Lets jump to the present ds9 and star trek timeline! I do only say section 31! an intel branch inside starfleet intel itself. If i look at the series, i do remember very tigh intel operations concerning watching for founders, fleet operations ect. ect. therefore i think starfleet should at least have c.i. level II if not III. Their counter espionage is very effective, their offensive espionage is well, lets look better at our heroes like sisko and picard and of course "captain" troy.

[AMF]

Well, I think there is also some impact on strategy and builds and so forth...and there is the nasty possibility that since everyone knows where everyone else's homeworld is, a player could outfit a long range warfleet on turn one, travel to their mortal enemies' system, and nuke their homeworld in the first 5 turns of the game. I wouldn't do that, cause it's unsporting and boring, but, still, having homeworld locations known is a pretty big thing, IMHO.

there are other implications: if I know where habitable systems are, then I probably will be able to maximize the effecieincy of my colonization. Why build scout ships, if I know where all the planets are already? If I know where the black holes are, I need never lose a ship to them...

And, well, exploration *is* fun!

In any case, I am in no matter what we decide...

really really shutting up now.

thanks,

Alarik
AKA Kirala of Klingon

Originally posted by Renegade 13:
And Alarikf, I think its fine leaving the map as is, because sooner or later, because of partnerships, or map trades etc, everyone will know almost all of the map anyways. So as long as no one player has knowledge of the map that the other players don't, there's really no reason why everyone couldn't know what it is beforehand is there? Besides the obvious aspect of exploration which is kinda fun. Or am I missing something here?

[Tnarg]

At game start there are 255 unconnected circles scattered throughout the map, as the map designer, I myself can't even remember which each one represents unless I look at the map in the map editor. So it is truly a matter of what one wants to get out of the game.

If you want to explore and make the most out of the game, don't look at the map in the editor. If you want to be unsporting and out for blood in a role played game, then look at the map and take the fun out. Simple.

I am not playing this game to win, I am playing to rewrite Cardassian history and enjoy every Last turn.