Wishlist: Ammo Loadouts, and Z-fire Abuse

[narwan]

I've run out of ammo with infantry on a number of accosions or at least had to adopt ammo-conservation tactics. And no, the shortages weren't due to overusing Z-fire!

As CBO pointed out, 90 rounds last only 15 rounds if you fire 6 shots per turn in your own turn. But only half that if they also fire max OP fire in the oppo's turn! While that isn't likely to happen, a unit that is heavily engaged both in it's own and during the opponents turn can easily run out of ammo in a 10-turn firefight. That's about half an hour of firing.

I've had that happen in infantry battles with fairly open terrain and little armor and heavy support weapons (early or pre ww2 for example) where you pound away at each other from hundreds of yards.


Narwan

[Mobhack]

Just remember that it is a "shot opportunity" for most weapons other than large arty or ATGM.

A snipers shot opportunity can kill 2 men, as can a single survivor crewman's "pistol shot".

SAA ammo loads are therefore "shot opportunities" and could be a couple of shots, or a short burst. There is no 1 to 1 relation between them and actual rounds carried.

As to Z fire, I hardly ever fire it myself, since you go through ammo really quickly with it and then really only from MG units onto areas I know are lousy with enemy infantry. Never "on spec" - mortars are for that purpose.

I never do the USA army "recce by fire" either, as the expenditure of fire is IMHO too much for the results obtained.

As posters have said, it is something that can be agreed beforehand as to what is "sensible". Myself, I would love an opponent who is going to blaze away like that as it gives my arty observers a nice big hint as to where some landscape gardening should be done !.

Cheers
Andy

[PanzerBob]

Good day

Just to throw my two pfennings worth in here. I have had infantry and MG's run out of ammo, especially in early war periods or battles where there are no or slow tanks and little transport except for boots. Personally I use Z or indirect fire usually if the weapons fit the role, MMG's, HMG's, 50's, 30's, StuG's, Centaurs, and Sturmpanzers to name a few all can be handy at this. But only at certain times, or in an act of desperation. To limit either ammo or Z fire makes no sense. I want plenty if up against a Polish Infantry charge in smoke!! I’d even be wary of a PBEM game that wants to limit these items and tactics.

Bob Out

[cbo]

Originally Posted by PanzerBob

To limit either ammo or Z fire makes no sense. I want plenty if up against a Polish Infantry charge in smoke!! I’d even be wary of a PBEM game that wants to limit these items and tactics.

Reminds me of one of those occassions where I ran out of MG ammo in infantry units. Playing as the Germans against the Poles, I learned that you could pin the Polish infantry between 500 and 600 meters by taking advantage of the German infantry units having MGs, while most of the Polish units did not. A small advantage, but when exploited, it did actually work by giving a small edge to the German party. But it drew a lot of MG ammo in those German units!

On a side note: I dont use Z-fire much, but I wonder how a proper machinegun barrage would work in SPWW2? It was often used in WW1, but I know a few occassions in WWII where the British used all the 36 Vickers HMGs of the MG battalion, firing indirectly, non-stop for a long period at a given area. The effect was apparently devastating, leaving the advancing infantry little more than mopping up to do.

Must try that some day

cbo

[Sniper23]

i've used it,it does work but it take's so many unit's and so much ammo that i only use it if i'm in a pinch.

[Griefbringer]

Being in a defensive position, and faced with wave attacks of poorly armed enemy infantry, it is entirely possible to start running low on small arms ammunition.

Against the AI, using the Z-fire feels somehow unfair, considering that the poor AI seems not to be able to use it. However, that is probably better than having to endure through long turns of AI using "recon by fire" left and right.

Griefbringer

[Sniper23]

Originally Posted by Griefbringer

Being in a defensive position, and faced with wave attacks of poorly armed enemy infantry, it is entirely possible to start running low on small arms ammunition.

Against the AI, using the Z-fire feels somehow unfair, considering that the poor AI seems not to be able to use it. However, that is probably better than having to endure through long turns of AI using "recon by fire" left and right.

Griefbringer

in 1941 (i think) i ran out of ammo lot's in the defence against japan with me as the us army.

i don't use z-fire much,i find that it is a waste of good ammo in the game.