Gem use, master enslave, high astral and oracle.

Soyweiser · #1 March 7th, 2011, 02:17 PM

I have a s10 oracle. With a amu of luck, a eye of the void, spell focus, and a ring of sorcery.

I script him to cast master enslace, returning, spells. Give him 13 s gems. And teleport him to a group of indies.

This is what happens. Turn one master enslave. Uses 11 gems. Turn two sometimes returning, sometimes normal enslave spells. (I think related to the nr of enemy commanders that are not enslaved).

But how can the spell use up 11 gems? It looks like the spell uses up more than one gem for fatigue reduction.

I also tested it with a s10 oracle (example above sans ring of sorc). It uses 10 gems then. And ends up with 112 fat. s11 79 fatigue.

(Damn while typing this somebody said this at irc:
[Raiel] It's "only one gem for increasing your level", you can use up to x gems, where x = your magic level per cast.
[Raiel] By per cast, I mean "on a single casting of the spell".
[Soyweiser] I thought, only one gem to increase your level, and this additional level also reduces the fatigue you get.
[Raiel] Yup, but you can use additional gems for fatigue reduction.
[Raiel] (It reduces fatigue if you already had enough levels in the path to cast the spell.)
)

So this is more a fyi post.

Peter Ebbesen · #2 March 7th, 2011, 03:47 PM

As you describe it, there's nothing mysterious unless I misunderstand you.

An S10 Oracle with a RoS equipped is an S11 caster and can thus use 11 gems. This is what happens in your first example.

Strip it of the RoS and it is an S10 caster and can use 10 gems. This is what happens in your second example.

WraithLord · #3 March 7th, 2011, 04:09 PM

This is the kind of info that belongs in the wiki

Soyweiser · #4 March 7th, 2011, 04:16 PM

I always thought that you could only use one gem for fatigue reduction. And that a x lvl caster could only use x gems. (So, a n3 caster can use 1 gem to reach n4 (which should also help with fatigue) and then cast a n4 spell that uses 3 gems).

I assumed that the level boost was linked to the fatigue boost.

Kobal2 · #5 March 8th, 2011, 03:11 AM

Nope, you can only use one gem to materially boost your magic paths. You can gobble as many gems as you darn well please to soak fatigue. Different concepts, even though in practice they have the exact same effect I believe (well, except that the one upgrade gems actually opens up new spells, instead of just making the Universe believe you're one level higher for fatigue purposes)

llamabeast · #6 March 8th, 2011, 08:56 AM

Aha, this is news to me too!

Amhazair · #7 March 8th, 2011, 01:36 PM

I'm not sure if some patch somewhere along the line changed the fatigue-reducing gem consumption mechanism? I seem to recall being certain that the stuff worked the way Soyweiser describes in his second post, and then at some point starting to be consistently surprised by casters using up more gems than they should according to my previous experiences. Long time ago though, so I'm absolutely not certain anymore.

Peter Ebbesen · #8 March 8th, 2011, 04:27 PM

Well, my memory says that the "you can use up to pathlevel gems to cast a spell of which one can be used to boost pathlevel and the rest to cover spellcost and fatigue reduction" mechanic has been in the game since Dominions 2, but it is such a long time since I played Dom2 that I may remember wrong. I'm pretty sure it has been that way since launch of Dom3, at the very least.

Kobal2 · #9 March 8th, 2011, 06:20 PM

No, nothing has changed and it's always been this way. Check page 89 of the (pdf) manual. There's even an example with a mage using one gem to raise paths, and a second one to reduce fatigue.

Jarkko · #10 March 9th, 2011, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kobal2

No, nothing has changed and it's always been this way. Check page 89 of the (pdf) manual. There's even an example with a mage using one gem to raise paths, and a second one to reduce fatigue.

You are reading it wrong

As has been pointed out in this thread already a few times, a mage can use at most as many gems as he has levels in the path, and one of those gems can be used to increase his level. This is the way it has always been

The example you point to tells this very clearly. The mage is an Astral 2 mage who wants to cast an Astral 3 spell. As he is Astral 2, he can use 2 gems. He uses one to raise his level to 3, and then the other to reduce the fatigue. It is explicitly stated he can not use three or more gems because his original skill (ie without the gem "boost") is 2.