Bogarus advice

secretperson · #1 July 3rd, 2008, 02:34 AM

I searched for any advice or guides concerning this nation and was unable to find anything! I am under the impression that this nation was added in a patch but yet there have been some comments already on Ashdod, Gath, and Hinnom that I found it odd there were none about Bogarus. Is this nation just not very popular?

Anyway, I'm looking for some general ideas on a good strategy or build for this nation. They have access to H3 priests but the recruitable troops have the interesting effect of producing unrest, according to the unit description, so perhaps using them as shock troops wouldnt be the wisest per se, but rather using behind enemy lines as spies and raiders... Would a bless approach be feasible here? Strong bless or weak bless? I have not checked out any of the summons to see if they are sacred or not which may or may not tip the scales in that area. It's a shame they dont have any sacred nation summons for blood magic as the commanders seem pretty well equipped for blood.

Any input or advice would be appreciated

Sombre · #2 July 3rd, 2008, 02:58 AM

I don't think a bless makes much sense for Bogarus. Their sacreds are pretty rubbish at actual fighting. If you did take one for them I guess minor air + fire 9 would be the only way to go.

A couple of their commander summons are sacred but it isn't a major theme and their recruitable mages aren't, so taking minor earth bless there doesn't make sense either.

The key strength of Bogarus is their insane researchers and mages. Considering they are an LA nation they might have just about the strongest magic going. Their national troops fit in two categories - good quality expensive cavalry and total dross meatshield infantry. Oh they do have cheapass archers for flaming arrows and whatnot though.

Kuritza · #3 July 3rd, 2008, 04:05 AM

Their infantry is now (properly) equipped with kite shields, which makes them more or less adequate, at least compared to what Caelum or monkeys get. Just dont send them against 2x blessed jaguars and dont expect them to kill heavy cavalry.
Bless strategy is out of question, but nature 4 seems to be a very good idea. You have no nature income nor nature mages, and your mages are just too old. Shroud of battle saint will make them last longer.

Regarding blood. Indeed, they dont have any national blood summons (why should they anyway).

But they can still have arch devils and ice devils if Mictlan/Marignon/Utgard dont fetch them all before. Archdevils can be summoned by your national mages (to fight in enemy dominion), for ice devils you will have to empower with blood (easily done anyway) your God or a Bereginya.

secretperson · #4 July 3rd, 2008, 04:23 AM

So what kind of pretender then? Should I go for awake SC to help with expansion? Or sleeping or imprisoned for uber scales?

chrispedersen · #5 July 3rd, 2008, 11:42 AM

No, the entire trick with bogus is the combination of communes with blood sabbaths. This is a commander heavy nation, you will need scales.

I like the race, interesting options.

sector24 · #6 July 3rd, 2008, 12:27 PM

Definitely need an awake SC for this nation. Your national troops are very weak so expansion will be slow and painful without one.

TheMenacer · #7 July 3rd, 2008, 01:23 PM

I don't know if you necessarily need an SC for expansion. I generally have a pretty easy time of it in SP with the swordsman infantry, who compare pretty favorably to light infantry, a handful of the really good cavalry units and a whole mess of the crappy archers being shuttled around by my prophetized starting commander set to smite constantly.

Given the reasonable effectiveness of that, I can't help but imagine that once you switch to using battlemages instead of just your one guy smiting individual targets, you'll really tear some [edit: haha, whoops. Gotta watch that language.] up.

Obviously that's not gonna protect you from other SC pretenders or bless rushes, but Bogarus benefits like crazy from a rainbow pretender because it's got tons of diversity, but no water or nature and it can't get to boosters in many of the paths it does have.

Also this has nothing to do with troops, but you can take cold 3 in pretender design for extra points, since all of your troops are cold resistant you don't feel any negative effects but the loss of income.

Zenzei · #8 July 3rd, 2008, 01:25 PM

I agree with sector24, an awake SC god is a must for Bogarus to get the expansion going. Their starting army is at lower end of spectrum and needs quite a lot of boosting before it becomes a viable force.

sector24 · #9 July 3rd, 2008, 02:00 PM

You can get away with a N/W pretender in SP for sure, but I think Bogarus is a prime target for a rush in MP. Dr. P wrote up a very detailed "first 5 turns" guide back when the nation came out using a Prince of Death with some earth magic. This was back when the infantry all had mapmove 1 and weaker shields. Things may have changed slightly but I still consider the national troops below average.

Sombre · #10 July 3rd, 2008, 07:19 PM

I think you can go for uberscales with Bogarus to fairly good effect. Once you start expanding (after the first few turns) their cavalry are up there with most other nations' national troops. It's really just right at the start that they suck, or in comparison with bless/trampler expanding nations.

Definitely more of a mid/late race though. Bit like Marverni or Patala.