Shrapnel game server

Lingchih · #1 June 9th, 2008, 12:08 AM

I have been venting a bit on game hosts dropping out lately.
Sorry If I have been a bit callous.

This begs the question though, why is there not a Shrapnel Dom 3 server? Dom 3 seems to be a popular game, with more people joining in regularly. The MP games fill up quickly. Could not Shrapnel, the publisher, host a Dom 3 network server? It would not be much work to set one up, and the cost would be very little. One employee set to administer the games. A part-time job at best.

Ironhawk · #2 June 9th, 2008, 12:52 AM

I dont think its fair to expect something like that from Shrapnel, which serves such a small market. If we paid subscription dues or something, maybe.

JimMorrison · #3 June 9th, 2008, 02:52 AM

Well, considering the small amount of actual bandwidth that (I imagine) is needed for the games, the main cost would be the hardware. What kind of hardware would be needed to host 10-20 games on one machine?

And if it were possible that we could donate funds to get said machine up and running, would it be possible that a simple interface could be set up, to allow a select few trusted people (like Llama, Ich, I dunno) to start and end the games, with just a couple of minutes actual effort spent here and there?

Not implying that anything is expected of anyone, just tossing out ideas here.

NTJedi · #4 June 9th, 2008, 03:26 AM

Quote:

JimMorrison said:
Well, considering the small amount of actual bandwidth that (I imagine) is needed for the games, the main cost would be the hardware. What kind of hardware would be needed to host 10-20 games on one machine?

And if it were possible that we could donate funds to get said machine up and running, would it be possible that a simple interface could be set up, to allow a select few trusted people (like Llama, Ich, I dunno) to start and end the games, with just a couple of minutes actual effort spent here and there?

Not implying that anything is expected of anyone, just tossing out ideas here.

If shrapnelgames wanted to continuing promoting DOM_3... they would find a way to provide a reliable server, even if it was from a 3rd party source.

Increasing a games popularity is more than just advertising. Usually we don't hear from the folks at Shrapnelgames unless it's advertising or someone's in trouble.

MaxWilson · #5 June 9th, 2008, 03:09 PM

Quote:

JimMorrison said:
Well, considering the small amount of actual bandwidth that (I imagine) is needed for the games, the main cost would be the hardware. What kind of hardware would be needed to host 10-20 games on one machine?

I think you mean "the administration." People are always more expensive than machines, and one of the reasons Shrapnel has given for not supporting downloadable distribution of Dom3 is that downloadable distribution's costs are dominated by support costs. I expect an official Dom3 server would be similar. How much time does llamabeast spend on the Llamaserver?

-Max

JimMorrison · #6 June 9th, 2008, 07:37 PM

The support cost for online distribution, I was under the impression, is mainly in people having various and sundry issues with the process. Otherwise, it's just a matter of infrastructure, and that's why you see less of the smaller outfits doing downloads, as the cost per unit goes down very fast once you have invested enough time and effort to get a system that "almost always" functions flawlessly for most customers.

I've noted Llama stating repeatedly that he has no qualms about hosting games for whoever asks, because it only takes him a couple of minutes to set them up. The largest drain is when people do blitzes, and for some reason people like to restart blitzes a lot, which leaves a lot of games needing resets, for nothing. Otherwise, the few minutes taken for a game that will last a month at least, is kind of trivial. And again, that's why I suggested that rather than this "part time job" system of paying a guy to hang around doing nothing all day, cooperation could be gained from people who already actively donate time to get extra games up, and who are trusted by the people in charge, to operate a more powerful system that requires even less effort on a per game basis.

I am sure that Llama, and Gandalf, would be happy to do the same service that they willfully already give the community, if they had the opportunity to do so without tying up their own hardware. Reasonably sure, that is.

Obviously it's not my decision to make, I was mostly just proposing that if someone in said position looked into it, I'd bet the project would have a very good chance of resolving in a way that led to faster, more powerful, and ultimately more reliable hosting, which should hopefully translate into a more robust MP community that would attract new customers by virtue of its existence. That's all.

(Edit: Especially if it were a larger "Shrapnel" server rather than just a Dom3 server, and could host other games as well.)

MaxWilson · #7 June 9th, 2008, 09:10 PM

Well, maybe you're right. I don't have much experience with Dom3 servers--I just remember from some of the Wishlist threads Llamabeast mentioning that a couple of new server switches would save him loads of time.

-Max

S.R. Krol · #8 June 9th, 2008, 10:07 PM

Hosting game servers have been batted around in the past but if I remember correctly the main reason nothing has been ever pursued are the time and support issues. Say someone is having problems with their game would we have time to help solve that along with everything else that goes on in the normal course of the day?

If we reach a point we think it is feasible I'm sure we'd do it, as we'd love to provide a place for MP gaming even beyond Dom3.

Tyrant · #9 June 9th, 2008, 10:41 PM

This has come up before, and at one point Shrapnel said that they were looking into it and asked for some advice from veteran hosts about how much hardware they would need etc. My impression was that they were going to hang back and see if it was really needed or if we would handle it on our own, and that they concluded that it wasn't really needed.

Though i would love to see a pro hosting service, i think they were right, I hardly ever have to wait long when i'm looking for a new game. (Though if Velusian is leaving us that might not continue to be true.)

On the flip side, it's such an easy thing to do i'm not sure why they don't. From Gandalf's posts and my own hosting experience it seems like you can run really quite few games on pretty modest hardware. My frakenstein 1G Win 98 p.o.s. does not break a sweat on three games for instance.Perhaps i'll do an experiment and see how many it can handle. As far as the time commitment goes, well, it's a bit of pain for a volunteer, but as an extra duty for an employee it would seem to be trivial. I do not know anything about the particulars of Shrapnel's business and i'm sure they have good reasons. <shrug>

There was also some general gaming site (Battlefield?) that tried to get a community going once, but i'm not sure if they actually provided hosting. They did not quite get Dominions and were focused on a ladder thing for 2 or 4 player games so it kinda just died on the vine.

chrispedersen · #10 June 9th, 2008, 11:39 PM

Hardware isn't a problem.. I have like 30+ PIII or PIV's lying around. Its the game setup and admin thats a bear.

Really it would be cool if someone would write an app that would allow html setup of a game.

Aka web interface to sign up, web interface to pick all the options etc.