Is magic worth it?!?

[General_Jah]

Hi guys,

I've played around 5-6 single player games so I guess i am still fairly new... but one thing I've unfortunately found in each game I've played is how LITTLE magic actually affects the outcomes of my battles...

I just can't figure out what I'm missing? In almost every single fight its the number and quality of troops that ensure victory... my mages just seem to soak up resources and don't really do much..

For example I am playing a Late age game with Arcoscephale and I cannot for the life of me see any spells that are going to be real game turners...

Could someone please tell me I am wrong and explain to me what spells with Arcoscephale will really make me whoop some butt in the fights?

I've tried casting the vine line of spells and they frequently aren't in range or don't hit, same thing with slime. Don't really have any nukes that do much more than hit 1 target.. big whoop I'd rather have 1 calvary unit than any one of my casters...

I just don't see how spells that at most affect 1 square which I believe it 3 targets, can affect the outcome of battles that are already having close to 100 enemy troops..

thanks in advance for the thoughts!

[DireAussie]

>Late age game with Arcoscephale

Generally speaking late age has less magic; late age mages have less magic skills. As stated on page 97 of the manual - "The early age has a predominance of magic, and as the ages progress, the primacy of arms and armor becomes pronounced".

Here's one strategy for making late game arco a strong magic nation: Take magic 3 and a strong dominion. Recruit sybils until you get a few level 3 astral. Build cheap forts and labs and then pump out mystics en-masse. Set your sybil to cast light of the northern star and set all your mystics to cast mind burn. Watch the enemy die.

Another strategy for late game arco involving magic: Take luck 3, turmoil 3 and an awake pretender you can use for early expansion (eg dragon), with magic keep in mind a good bless effect. Recruit mystics and go for arcane probing (evocation) then conjuration 5. While researching conjuration, use arcane probing to find astral sites and use mystics that have a high magic skill to find magic sites (you should have lots of provinces you can search due to quick early expansion). By the time you have conjuration 5 you should have gotten plenty of magic gems from luck 3 and from magic site searching. Convert the gems to astral and use your mystics to cast ritual spell Summon Sirrush. Use your newly acquired uber blessable mutant-dragons to smash the enemy.

[Gandalf Parker]

If you are playing small maps, weak independents, many opponents, then you are correct. In those cases, magic is not as likely to be a big factor in winning the game.

But consider where you are on a scale between the smallest option of those, and the largest. There are game settings where magic becomes a major factor. This is also true of resources, or gold, or dominion strength, rainbow gods, SC's, or blessings. In some game settings they are important factors, and in others they are not so much.

On a large map, with half the opponents, and hard independents, I think you would find that magic becomes very important to winning the game. And more important on mid to late game combats.

[Sombre]

When I first started out I felt much the same, but later on magic picks up steam and becomes powerful enough to wreck entire mundane armies without breaking a sweat. Part of the problem is that low level spells tend to be so useless, but if you want a quick and easy demonstration of how effective magic can be, I'd suggest going with EA Abysia and going all out to research evocation spells. Then send out your fire mages to spam stuff like falling fires. Quickly gives you an idea of how effective magic is.

Note: I'm not saying EA Abysia is a great magic nation, just that they provide an easy to see example and you don't get friendly fire problems.

[Micah]

Nature has horrible evocation spells, and astral isn't very good against large hordes of troops, but mind burn spam is fairly nice if your opponent is fielding lots of expensive units, like cavalry, and soul slay for anything larger than that. Both of those paths are more focused on support magic. Astral is the king of winning fights off the battlefield, with great mobility spells (teleport/gateway/astral travel) and mind hunt which can take out enemy leaders, leaving their troops stranded. Nature has great global enchantments.

Astral especially has some really nice high level spells. Try casting astral tempest, antimagic and will of the fates in a large battle (against human-type opponents, astral tempest won't be so good against high hp or MR opposition since your own troops are fragile) and see how things go.

Also, drop body ethereal, luck, and regeneration on an SC chassis and watch them go to town, just make sure they have some reinvigoration and decent protection and they should be good to go.

[Saxon]

Get a few astral mages with Body Ethereal. Put one of them in the middle of each of your squads. Put the squads on "hold and attack." Script your mages to cast Body Ethereal three times, then whatever you want.

A fair number of your regular troops will now avoid 70% of the attacks that would have otherwise hit them. It is not a nuke, but you will find you will a lot more battles!

[lch]

General_Jah said:
Hi guys,

I've played around 5-6 single player games so I guess i am still fairly new... but one thing I've unfortunately found in each game I've played is how LITTLE magic actually affects the outcomes of my battles...

You don't HAVE to use magic if you don't need it, but you're seriously handicapping yourself by that. Later the game is all about the mages.

General_Jah said:
For example I am playing a Late age game with Arcoscephale and I cannot for the life of me see any spells that are going to be real game turners...

Could someone please tell me I am wrong and explain to me what spells with Arcoscephale will really make me whoop some butt in the fights?

Some examples: Doom, Will of the Fates in battle. Arcane Domination, Master Enslave aswell if you can get it off via communions or whatever. Mind Hunt / Soul Slay against a non-astral nation. Magic Duel against an astral nation.

[thejeff]

Saxon said:
Get a few astral mages with Body Ethereal. Put one of them in the middle of each of your squads. Put the squads on "hold and attack." Script your mages to cast Body Ethereal three times, then whatever you want.

Now try that with your elephants. Add in some Luck as well.

[Warhammer]

Wrath of God is an awfully nice Astral spell that kills your opponent's troops. Playing single player right now and 300 troops are wounded and 100+ are killed every turn with me doing nothing.

[SlipperyJim]

Short Answer: Yes, magic is certainly worth it.

Remember that magic is about more than simply tossing battlefield nukes. As others have written, Astral magic is really more for support than for blasting.

Here are several non-battlefield uses of Astral magic:

• quick transportation -> Teleport, Gateway, Astral Travel
• reconnaissance -> Astral Window, Eyes of God
• site-searching -> Acashic Record
• commander-killing -> Mind Hunt
• defense -> Dispel, Dome of Arcane Warding
• dominion-pushing -> Telestic Animates, Juggernauts
• WISH ('nuff said)

Astral magic also offers some nice Construction possibilities: Pendants of Luck, Amulets of Antimagic, Rings of Sorcery and Wizardry (to boost other paths), Spell Foci, Robes of Shadows, and that Shroud thingy to bless your non-sacred commanders.

However, Astral magic can also be handy on the battlefield. Besides the tactics that have already been mentioned, here are a few more:

• Stellar Cascades -> No, it's not as impressive as the Abysian BBQ, but it can be just as effective. Dish out massive AP stun damage to large numbers of badguys. Then your troops can kill them easier....
• Star Fires -> Cheap, simple ... armor-negating damage. Great for opponents with a lot of protection and not many HP.
• Solar Rays -> Reasonably effective anti-undead spell. Kill hordes of zombies.

I can also attest to the effectiveness of the previously-mentioned Mind Burn and/or Soul Slay. Sure, each spell only kills one unit, but that's great against an opponent with expensive, hard-to-kill units. Set up a row of Mystics with Spell Foci (to increase magical penetration) and start zapping.