Who uses an All-Paths Pretender?

[dandavis]

I've been playing this strategy for some time now... mostly with Jotunheim, using the Skratti pre-patch and the Son of Neifel post-patch.

Basically it involves taking lvl 2 in every magic path (except blood) and gradually upgrading until I have a complete lvl 4 magic site-finder. An added benefit of this is access to most crafted items, most battle spells, and a large gem income.

While I haven't taken this strategy into the late-game, it's certainly kept me competitive against the AI. I know this is probably a pretty basic strat, and I know conversations on this board have progressed well beyond this topic, but I'm still new to the game and am very interested in your thoughts.

So... anyone else using this strat? Anyone got any comments on it?

[Skolem]

Originally posted by dandavis:
I've been playing this strategy for some time now... mostly with Jotunheim, using the Skratti pre-patch and the Son of Neifel post-patch.

Basically it involves taking lvl 2 in every magic path (except blood) and gradually upgrading until I have a complete lvl 4 magic site-finder. An added benefit of this is access to most crafted items, most battle spells, and a large gem income.

While I haven't taken this strategy into the late-game, it's certainly kept me competitive against the AI. I know this is probably a pretty basic strat, and I know conversations on this board have progressed well beyond this topic, but I'm still new to the game and am very interested in your thoughts.

So... anyone else using this strat? Anyone got any comments on it?

It is known as a RB (Rainbow Mage). To be cost effective you mostly make it with so called, 10 point path pretenders, (what were your scales with a Son of Niefel?). In mid game you will have a awesome gem income but you will not be specialised (don't have a path with 9-10) so you can't cast the nastier spell.You will have problems because your will not be really tough (assuming 10 point path pret.), so you can't rely on him in taking indies, and have to fear attacs from other player in mid-late game. I don't know if it is played by good player in competitive MP, but there are some game with house rules who cry after such a concept, and he can be really fun in SP.
Skolem

[Lex]

pretty new myself, but i've found that 'all-paths' (or 'rainbow' as its references on the forum) isn't all that useful. But its probably just my playstyle. I like to mass equip all my main units. Even by midgame that means at least a dozen or more of everything. And I'm not a very patient fellow, so I won't wait a dozen turns for my Pretender to forge my armory.

Rather, I prefer forging items that my national casters can forge (even if it means equiping them all with a level boost). I've read that some people like to go after a handful of items that only two or three of their casters can produce. That's also reasonable. But when the only one who can produce the items is your Pretender, that's means if you lose an army, it'll be quite a while before you can get re-equipped. And that's a big risk.

Then again, you could also use Alchemy to convert gems you don't need into ones you do need. But I'd much rather spend the points on better scales and use my casters to search sites using spells (that also makes it possible to search all your provinces alot more efficiently if you a group of casters taking breaks from their busy research to cast the right spell to search all your provinces for the gems you need.

Also, in my even limited experience, i've found that searching EVERY site with your pretender is difficult, time-consuming, and sometimes you wish your pretender was doing better things so early in the game. Whereas its extremely easy to search every province, as you gain them, with your casters. The trade off is you can only search (cheaply) for your 'national' gems (the gems you start off with in your capital).. other types of gems you need to send some guys out to search manually, until you get a bit of them, and can start casting the spells. But once you get going, its very easy to get really high gem income.

[ August 03, 2004, 19:00: Message edited by: Alexi ]

[Skolem]

Originally posted by dandavis:
I've been playing this strategy for some time now... mostly with Jotunheim, using the Skratti pre-patch and the Son of Neifel post-patch.
Basically it involves taking lvl 2 in every magic path (except blood) and gradually upgrading until I have a complete lvl 4 magic site-finder.

I just tried what you say and it leaves me with 54 points, so assuming cold 3 , I can take say 2 Order and it leaves me with 94 Points maybe 1 water more and a castle or 1 growth and 1 Prod. I would not play Jotun with that scales... I think Jotuns is one of the race who need the most beneficial scales (anyone to contradict me? ), also Why don't take blood, you can (it is only difficult) build a blood economy with the giants, so they would profit of it. If you want to play a RB mage you should try with a 10-20 path pretender , maybe the Ghost King would be just nice.

[Skolem]

Originally posted by Alexi:
And I'm not a very patient fellow, so I won't wait a dozen turns for my Pretender to forge my armory.
But when the only one who can produce the items is your Pretender, that's means if you lose an army, it'll be quite a while before you can get re-equipped. And that's a big risk.

You don't use only your pretender for forging. Untill midgame you use him as a sitesearcher. Believes me the amount of Gems you will have has no comparison to any other strat. After this you can forge one or two magic boost to summon Mage with the path you don't have, with the time you will have a lot of Mage with a lot of different path combos and they will allow you to equip (in the mid-late game) 2 to 3 SC fully in one turn. It will be no problem because the amount of gem your pretender gives you is really amazing.

[Pickles]

Originally posted by Skolem:

"believes me the amount of Gems you will have has no comparison to any other strat. "

except clam spamming or similar..
But is is a good income & you do not need to keep boosting your pretender for searching - or at least by the time I have readily available boosts I have better things to do

Pickles

[ August 03, 2004, 19:27: Message edited by: Pickles ]

[Lex]

i guess if you go for lots of gems (with a rainbow pretender), you're probably gonna rely mainly on summons+casters+SCs and a bit of troop backup if any? or do you still need large troop armies.

[Skolem]

Originally posted by Alexi:
i guess if you go for lots of gems (with a rainbow pretender), you're probably gonna rely mainly on summons+casters+SCs and a bit of troop backup if any? or do you still need large troop armies.

I would say it depends on the Race played, if you have good national troops you build them, if not you mostly have good mage to summon what you lack of. For exemple with caelum I build a begining army with wingless Temple guards and Mammoths to conquer Indies, and mid game I switch for Storm Guards with Spring Hawks and if I can Storm Devils. I would build much more national with Jotunheim for exemple, but this choice doesn't depend on your Pretender but rather on your national troops and their abillities to be usefull in late Game (best exemple would be Mictlan and Abyssia Blood of Human were Blood Summons are your real national troops)
Skolem

[Skolem]

Originally posted by Pickles:
except clam spamming or similar..
Pickles [/QB]

No one says you couldn't do that with your RB

[Pickles]

I also forgot to mention that its strength must depend on the gem richness chosen. Blood races are relatively better & rainbows worse on poor maps. I am not sure at what level the balance is best - I suspect it is at somewhat more thanthe default "40"

Pickles