A pirates life for me...

[WhiteHojo]

Suicide - I'd like to take a look at em if you don't mind - you're earlier Posts got my mind to wandering and I've come up w/some other potential pirate tech (none unbalancing, but more test/thinking need to be had)...

The only thing you didn't mention that I feel a pirate race might need (and that I'm toying with) a ScrapYard... a smaller space yard, say 100KT, that can't repair or build anything - but is based on the space yard component so it can be used to scrap and recover resources from captured ships.

I also like the machine shop & the mini space yard (low repair abilities and lower build rate than a norm SY) but I called it a Retro Yard - used to retrofit capture space hulls in the field. A rate of say 500/750/1000 for the 3 different levels...

ideas and comments always welcome

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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[This message has been edited by WhiteHojo (edited 07 March 2001).]

[Suicide Junkie]

That scrap yard would provide the same abilities of the retro yard.

All you have to do is make a space yard that builds with 0 resources per turn.


The mini space yard was only really intended as a method of getting started on secret nebula-bases during the early years, since it won't require a cruiser hull, but only an escort hull (crammed), or a frigate hull (full movement), or destroyer (some defence)

It is clear to me that the first Ten years are most critical for a pirate race. They have to keep their homeworld alive & pumping research until they get ship capture. Then it's less critical, but still very important for retrofits, until you get cruisers around turn 80, and then can build secret bases by turn 100. A pirate racial trait that gives quick access to tiny space yards & basic ship capture would solve these problems, but until then its an epic struggle to capture the newest tech before you are overwhelmed.

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One thing that I have just recently added, is a bifurcation of the PD tech. Point defence Cannons, are kinetic-kill weapons, so they do good damage, but only at short range (2-4) PD lasers, do less damage (1/2), but extend out to range 4-8.

This works good, since you have to balance each type. Cannons defend you, lasers defend your fleet, but less powerfully.

Other than that, they are identical. I think I may link the cannons to DUC techs and the lasers to energy stream techs. Both will still require PD tech.

[edit]
The zip should contain:
-components.txt
-Facilities.txt (only the massive planetary shields changed)
-TechArea.txt (only a few increases of max levels)
-Pirate Alliance.emp Some basic settings for the Pirates. Anything thats not at its minimum value may be changed to your preferences, and you'll still be pirates.

Tell me if anything is missing/not working

[This message has been edited by suicide_junkie (edited 07 March 2001).]

[WhiteHojo]

quote:

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Originally posted by suicide_junkie:
That scrap yard would provide the same abilities of the retro yard.

All you have to do is make a space yard that builds with 0 resources per turn.)

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That was my thinking also - I played around and made one Last nite - based it on a SY - 100KT size, 1/4 the cost to build, no repair abilities & no build abilities. The concept is that it would be available early in the game and would be able to be placed on a small hull and taken to the front lines and used to rapidly recover resources from captured ships.

quote:

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The mini space yard was only really intended as a method of getting started on secret nebula-bases during the early years, since it won't require a cruiser hull, but only an escort hull (crammed), or a frigate hull (full movement), or destroyer (some defence)

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The mini space yard would be good in this early role but I kinda saw it as a component that is available after the retro yard. kind of cross b/t the retro yard and the full SY...

quote:

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A pirate racial trait that gives quick access to tiny space yards & basic ship capture would solve these problems, but until then its an epic struggle to capture the newest tech before you are overwhelmed.

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I thought this also, so I created a special tech area called Pirate Tech. Since this new are is not in the other AIs tech research files, they won't research it and thus won't be confused over the use of the specialized components that come out from this area. Actually, I just made my new components (your Machine Shop, Retro Yard, Refit yard, or small space yard if you will, and a small colony unit I'm toying around with) all require 2 tech abilities - ie. a machine shop needs level 1 in repair and level 1 in Pirate Tech...

The colony thing is just mind candy - thought about a small, slow moving limited cargo capacity, semi cheap colony ship only available to pirates - haven't thought it all the way through yet. Hull size of 150KT, 2 engine max, no cargo holds, colony unit size of 100kt that holds only 1M people...

thanks for the files - I'll look em over in the next couple of days.


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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[Suicide Junkie]

I don't know about the colonies.

I'm thinking that pirates should not be expanding by colonizing planets, but by building scrap yard/ retrofit bases in the outlying systems.

Then you just take your ships to scrap for funds or retro for more capture ability.

If pirates start colonizing, then research gets too high & resource production gets high & then they can build their own ships with more advanced tech.

I would like a pirate race that has no need for planets after the first year or so.

[Nitram Draw]

It is very difficult to create a Pirate Race without some house rules for the human. The AI could be programmed to a degree but would be difficult to.
To exclude all the colony, mining, research and intel techs would require the entire current tech tree to be made a racial trait. Then each AI would have to be programmed to accept it.
You can design pirate facilities, weapons and such and make them a racial trait. When you choose to play a pirate you would restrict yourself to items on the main tech tree that were not available in the pirate trait.
I would love to play this type of race. It would be a great change from the normal game.

[WhiteHojo]

I shoulda been a little clearer - the pirate colony ship was meant to replace the normal colony ship - smaller size, lower cargo, slower speed should be a good handicap to the pirate race... I meant for the race to not use the normal large colony ships. A pirate race couldn't afford the subtraction of 45M population so the 1M that the smaller colonizer used would be more appropriate, the slower speed is meant to limit their expansion.

the only problem I have to figure out is how to program a race to NOT use the normal colonizers... also, I would like to be able to limit a pirate colony to only small or tiny planets - don't know how or even if it's possible to do this.

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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[Suicide Junkie]

If you don't want to depopulate, just use a standard colony ship and manually transfer 1M.

The point I'm trying to make is that pirates should not have ANY colonies.

In the game I'm playing, My homeworld has been producing more resources than I need. The two colonies just add to that.

Only recently have I run low. Since I recently got Crew converters, and I'm trying to retrofit 60 ships.
After running out of minerals, I started trading with the other races, but now I'm out of organics & radioactives too. I've actually had to capture ships for scrap, and I get just over one ship retroed for each scrap ship.

IMO, pirates should not be using planetary-made resources like this. Scrapping should be important, so therefore no colonies should be allowed. Captured Colony ships provide 100% of my new colonies (so far, 100 turns in, thats two colonies & one on the way after repairs)

I am in 1st place, with higher tech than anybody else and haven't built a single colony ship! I control 3 planets and one colony ship.

It is my firm belief that (human) pirates do not need, and should not have colony tech in any way shape or form. Colony Captures are unavoidable, but acceptable.

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How did I get first in tech levels with only 10,000 research points you ask?
Simple - everybody else researched different tech areas, and I stole 'em all.

[WhiteHojo]

I agree w/you on the point that pirates should get their research & resources from capturing ships. However, w/o a small at least, colony base building intell centers any race that specializes in intell ops would be able to cause quite a bit of havok.

One could simply manually limit oneself to only loading 1M colonist, not placing more than 2 engines on a colony ship or by manually not moving a colony ship more than 2 engines movement worth per turn but to me, it's more fun to have a specific colony ship type for pirates that are designed to behave in the manner I want it to. A self imposed limit (I wish I knew of some way to program the limitation into the component) on colonization I would use is to only colonize tiny or small planets (actually leaning toward only tiny - moons, etc). this, to me, would help prevent any overexpansion (pop wise) of the race while providing a small core of planets to build intell centers on.

just my 2 cents worth - feedback is always helpfull.

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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[Suicide Junkie]

Perhaps it would be better to just give the pirate race a huge intel bonus (eg. +400%)

But anyways, Intel I is a 100,000 point tech, and with 5000 research, and ship capture to research, Intel can't be a priority.

Maybe only allow defensive Intel projects, but give the pirates a bonus of 50,000 Intel points /turn as a racial trait.


I just turned off intel, the simplest solution.

[WhiteHojo]

Opps - double posted - erased this one

[This message has been edited by WhiteHojo (edited 08 March 2001).]