End game diversity mod

[ExHeretic]

You have good eye for details

Instead of talking about vanilla i should have said non EDM
I'm mixing my mods here

The games i play in vanilla are usually so small that gemgens won't brake the game or have no gemgens as houserule. I still think that dom is at its best played 1 vs 1 on large map

[rdonj]

I guess it seems like the ettin and treant would be a lot better off if they took a price decrease, I think that is probably the best buff they could get at this point and would make more people willing to consider using them.

Also, ettins are anti-thugs, not thugs in and of themselves. 3 swords of swiftness + boots of quickness... mm. Gate cleaver/midget masher and a shield. 3 scutata volturnus and 2 spirit helms?

[Finalgenesis]

There are more cost effective anti-thugs solution then decked out ettins. Sure you can make them work, but at a larger gem cost then other alternatives, they are just not an efficent choice gem-wise (N too!).

[Sajuuk]

Since I have joined 2 EDM MP and its all 60-70 turns now, here's my feed back:

Zmey:they are very good raiders in mid games. They can easily take down 20+ pd, they can fly, and spell like mind hunt or soul slay have to success 3 times. Even a teleport sc may be tear down before he/she cast self buff. "May be", though, so I wont risk them in late games, following army as thugs would be enough. In one game TC have summoned about 12 zmeys but been hunted down by abysia one by one.

Shishi can kill a tartarian titan! But in other occasion, it is not so impressed.

Cyclops: It may be a good sc, but seems people who summon it would prefer to use it as E3 mage to cast armies of XX or earthquake

Wendigo: As sc, it is not as powerful as many other summons. But it is eventually a D4 mage! D4=cheap tartarian summoner! 24W is so cheap that you can even mass it as life drain/skelly spam/undead mastery caster

Asynja: Very powerful raider of cause, but i have to say i'm disapointed when three of them been swarmed by devils, summer lions and even Scorpion beasts.....Anyway, not a good sc doesnt means its not a good A mage. With a high chance to be A3, it is an excellent BE caster for non air nations.

Grendelkin: It is a surprise that they can be so powerful. True, they dont perform well as raiders, but followed with an army, they are excellent anti-sc OR SC. give them some anti sc weapons, few sc could stand against their strength, while give them a midget smasher, and buff quickness, its.....terrible. In one game two player summoned about half a dozen each and going to throw them to each other. But on the other game, one player summoned at least a dozen as raiders, yet many been killed by ghost riders.....

Treants are too costy, few people would spent 40N on them. But if you are rich in N while have little difficulty in tartarians(like me in one game, at the brink of destruction), summon them would give you a surprise. Sure they are good raiders when in forest, but following an army they are more powerful, thanks to its multiple weapons. give them a fire brand and a sword of quickness, they can cut down sc like Asynja easily. Oh, did I mention that if you give it a flying carpet, it will able to move while rooted? A bug of cause, which saved a command"change shape"

Will add ember lord and others later

[llamabeast]

Awesome feedback sajuuk, thanks!

[DeadlyShoe]

The flying carpet makes perfect sense! You just put it under the soil its rooted in. :]

[Sajuuk]

That would be a huge carpet lol

Why I can't edit my post? Anyway, ember lord, its amazing, perhaps too powerful combined with some tricks:a hydra skin armor for regenaration and a earth boot for summon earth power and invulnerability，or a rime hauberk for cold immune even after cast stone skin, and a "ice&fire" aura for double fatigue damage, or something give it berserker so that it won't rout before its pheonix pyre fully utilized....A obvious effect is it greatly improve the priority of eternal pyre, in one game 3 players try to control it, though in the end it was replaced by a maelstrom. It costs 60 gems, less than 2 zmey, so if not in desperate condition people will surely same gem for them rather than summon dozens of zmey like TC in one game. Poor tc, his enemy abysia now have 7 fully geared ember lords, and able to summon 2 every 3 month due to a site.

mechanical man: Seems nobody construct them except ma agartha——80 HP makes it worth trying. However, his giants were cutted into pieces by hundreds of samurai along with some marble oracle. I dont know if it is because he didn't equip them well. 12 mr is also a deadly flaw when someone try to use opposition, control or disintegrate against it

Ettin: 3 weapon with 6 ambidextrous, relatively high attack and considerable strength, it would be an excellent anti sc while quicken, but it seems hard to survive swarm of chaff when try to get close to enemy sc. Or we can give it 3 shield and a boot of behemoth, but a trampler can hardly be useful when you have reach enchantment 7...Maybe someone have summoned one or two just in case, but others just ignore it. I summoned one in one game, but so far only give it a crown of ivy king AND a ivy crown to summon vine man free chaff as ivy lord 3.....

true fire bird: I don't know if some one have it. maybe only those who have too many F or really need free solar brilliance will summon it.

roc: I use to think it is much less useful compare to shishi, but actually its seige and patrol bonus alone worth more than 18 gems.....flying and deep striking seige engines can tear down your multiple castles in one turn......

kraken: so far no real feat done by them.....

[Sajuuk]

Speaking of magical diversity, just a summon provide diversity will be too easy comparing tartarians——tartarians need not only luck on path distribution but also luck on creature type,difficulty in getting high D and N path as well as gem incom, and hardest of all, possess goh or chalice. Otherwise you can only pray that the next tart are not feebleminded.

One solution I have suggested before is tarts cannot be healed, or at least much harder to be healed so that no overwhelming advantage for those who control GOH or chalice.

Now I have a new idea inspired by djinn: An artifect that cost highly(25 or 40gems for instance) .It functions like magic lamp that must be equiped and "summoned", and get a mage with random path, or one of several mages with different random paths. The artifect are unique but the mages are not, so when the mages been summoned, the artifect can be forged by anyone again.

Or it can also be a item of construction 6 rather than artifect, costly and maybe even cannot recieve forge bonus if modded availible. When summon from this item, only a chance to get a diverse-pathed mage, otherwise it summons useless chaff.


Another idea is inspired by rlyeh void gate and a mod I used to see: A GE, or a unique summon which is immobile, pathless, or an artifect. Anyway, its name is "summoning portal" or whatever, and while GE is active,or the summoned "portal" is alive and performing its own order(like summon allies), or the artifect is equiped and performing the order it provide(like opening gate), then mages of random path will constantly/occasionally show up in your capital. This method is harder to get mages than previous one.

Or expand the summoned unit idea: Its a non unique pathless immoble unit called "summoning portal" which also have chance to summon mages of diversed path, but the "portal" itself will be "closed" any turn just function like a doom horror disappears

[Finalgenesis]

Mech giant has 40 hp or close to it, Agartha (MA) has a golem aura that gives constructs a hp bonus under its dominion (like prophet / gift of health, higher the better, that drains away slowly outside of its dominion), so things like gargoyles and mech giants has greatly enhanced hp there, could it be that? Indeed, it has great weaknesses along with its great strength.

[WraithLord]

I have used Ettins in SP only. What with no hammers and bad starting equip and high enc. they are serviceable but don't shine. Perhaps a tad expensive for what you get. Which is not necessarily bad for not all magic variants should be the same (i.e. Fire shines in evo. Death in summons etc).

I saw Shishis in action in MP. They are right on the mark. SC wise they're a glass cannon. i.e. can kill a SC but OtOH die to numbers of lesser units (like GR). They serve to fill a much needed lack in this niche.

No idea re. the rest, never had the chance to see or use them.