The Council of Wyrms

[shovah]

but i am **** when it comes to files (too many files on my pc)

[The Panther]

Having done both, I can assure you that server games are a much bigger hassle for the players. PBEM games are quite easy to do, as that is how the game was designed to be played by the devs. PBEM games are a hassle only the host.

As for myself, I don't plan on playing another server game ever again.

[Huntsman]

The Panther said:
Having done both, I can assure you that server games are a much bigger hassle for the players. PBEM games are quite easy to do, as that is how the game was designed to be played by the devs. PBEM games are a hassle only the host.

I've done both too and a properly set up server game is no more a hassle than a PBEM game, IMHO.

[Ygorl]

Shovah, you only need to take the one .trn file each turn and put it into the COW folder. Takes about fourteen seconds to uncompress and move, tops. Then, after you end your turn, take another six seconds to send The Panther your .h2 file. It adds a trivial amount of time to the process, and since you don't have to save all the .trn files (you can overwrite the old one with the new one) you don't even accumulate masses of files. In short, it's not a big deal.

[Morkilus]

Don't know if it will help, but I found Alneyan's multiplayer guide to be valuble for playing PBEM's. It seems alot simpler than server games to me, too. Here's the link:
web page

[Huntsman]

Morkilus said:
Don't know if it will help, but I found Alneyan's multiplayer guide to be valuble for playing PBEM's. It seems alot simpler than server games to me, too. Here's the link:
web page

Well, like I said, if you have a decent server op then it's a snap. The server's I've played on had their own notification scripts too which emailed everybody to tell them the new turn had hosted. Then all you had to do was load the game, take your turn, and exit. Doesn't get much easier than that.

PBEM is easy too once you get the routine down.

[The Panther]

Actually, it is a lot more complicated than that, especially late game when turns can take an hour+ to do.

1. You must not accidently hit end turn when you first go into the server, or you will download a blank turn. If you are the last one to move, you have a stale. I can't possibly recall all the times this happened to me. You must always remember to hit the little "X" box instead of "End Turn".
2. You do your turn off-line and then you must upload it before the deadline. Since the deadline always changes (due to the fact that it is dependant on the last person who finished their turn), it can be hard to remember when the turn is due.
3. If you are the last to make your move, you frequently want to wait to the last minute so you do not get too much "time-creep". But if you wait too long, you have a stale.
4. And you need to check to see if there is a new turn up because the email notification does not always work correctly.
5. The ip address can change every time there is a crash.
6. The hosting deadlines can change significantly every time there is a crash.
7. Server games have been known to crash so bad that you cannot recover. This has happenned to me twice and to my son once. No PBEM game has ever went down this path for me.

Actually, most of these issues can be solved by a properly run server, which means NO QUICK HOST!!!! But the servers are rarely set up without the QH option.

I have had stales in EVERY SINGLE server game I have ever played. And I have had stales in EXACTLY ZERO PBEM games I have played. This is a lot of MP games for me (about 20, split approximately half server and half PBEM).

For the first 40 or so turns, both methods are about the same except that the server game can go a lot faster in most cases. But around turn 70 or so when the moves become very complicated and you have 100 messages to pour through, PBEM is far more flexible and forgiving, imho.

[Cainehill]

Which is why I'm rather fond of a server game using QH for the first 20 turns or so, then fixed hosting. As you say, it's nice to know when the turn is going to host, and not have to try and get the turn in at the last moment to keep it from creeping.

Oh, and I believe the server game can be set to automatically back up the game files before hosting, making it possible to recover from the corrupted game if need be.

[Huntsman]

Actually, most of these issues can be solved by a properly run server, which means NO QUICK HOST!!!!

Case closed.

I could counter-point every single item on your list based on my personal experiences but you've already done that with your disclaimer quoted above. Really, it depends on the specific server and configuration settings. Making a blanket statement saying "all server games are horrendously inefficient and cumbersome!!" (in so many words) is rather unfair.

[The Panther]

Fellow wyrms, we have our first crisis.

shovah is obviously not going to make the first move. This leaves me with two options:
1. Host the turn and force a stale. He will likely become AI fairly soon and we will then have a 16 player game. The nations who started next to Mictlan will have a huge advantage, especially if they invade early and kill his pretender with wyrm power before his Smoking Mirror gets enough buffs to survive in a world full of powerful fighting pretenders.
2. Try to find a sub. This will be extremely difficult since he did not take a wyrm pretender and therefore has no vote in Council.
3. Recruit a new player and start the game over on Sunday or Monday. Let the new player make a new pretender for Mictlan.

One thing to note is that I will be out of town on a camping trip starting tomorrow. After tonight, I will be unable to do any hosting until I get back home on Sunday.

Opinions? Right now, I do not plan of hosting the turn unless there is an outcry demanding it.