MP: YARG3, non newb MA+ENP2 RAND game. Executor's Ulm winner on turn 76

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by WraithLord

Calahan, I moved that stack b/c Ctis was massing armies on my borders in that area. I wanted a military presence in the area so that my lands wouldn't seem like easy picking.

I haven't got the turns to hand right now, but was the province next to the Eriu cap the only province you could move to so that you covered the C'tis angle? Wasn't that army all MM2 or MM3? And to me it seemed C'tis's movements were very consistant with simply "grabbing a bit of Eriu", and I saw no intent against Van or Svag (although you may have different intel and view). But if that is the case then it looks like we both had little faith in our neighbours As you moved in reaction to C'tis, and I moved in reaction to your reaction.

[Executor]

Thanks everyone.

Personally, I think you play too cautiously WL. That's something that stuck with me from our former games. I watched every single one of your battle from turn 30 onward. Actually i watched the entire map for quite some time. I had a few dozen crystal orbs and a very extensive scout/spy system going. There was nothing I didn't see.
Also monitoring the rest helped identify you too.

Valerius, apart from the Forge, which I think is the biggest problem, I also would blessing of steel too powerful. A handful of flail infantry had no problem dealing with indea 9 from the start under blessings of steel. Having a 24 protection troop is too much from start I think.
That small amount of diversity with smiths (20% A/S/F) is huge too. Not that I'd suggest removing it, it just opens up a load of new options. New forging possibilities and communions mostly (either with s smiths or trough matrixes).
In any case I'd say Ulm is one of the best MA nation, if not all era nations.

mockingbird, god damn I hated you dude. All I wanted was those two slots for global spells. I just couldn't figure out a way to kill your pretender not to mention breach the fort. It would have taken me a hundred gate cleavers.

Calahan, I noticed instantly that a new player had taken over Svarogia. You even got me scared there for a moment but then I realized there wasn't anything really dangerous in your possession.
As to how Svarogia fell and how I obtained the 3 or rather 4 last VPs;
Shiny cap was the first to go. It was rather easy to take as Shiny had most of his troops in the adjacent fort.

The second fort, Eriu, fell to about 500 teleported troops (gate stone and astral travel) and a few mages and a SC. There was nothing in the fort to protect it and no troops near so it was easy taking.
The other Svarogia fort was Man, which fell to troops, commanders, mages, thugs and SCs. Not too large an army though and it was a tough battle too. Could have lost that one.
The third fort for the win was Al Nadin (C'tis). There was no chance in hell any army could have protected that fort. I had just too many stuff in that army.

And the fail safe capital was Bandar Log. (Van) Also a heck of a lot of stuff in it.

Curious Yellow, and there I was actually thinking on joining the war on your side until Shiny attacked me. Well, rather tried to sneak in troops into my lands which resulted in me attacking him. I even gave him a turns change to withdrew the troops but he moved them further in.

Actually, the only nation I attacked in this game was TC. And that was a hilarious war. I attack TC, Ashdod joins in from the other side and grabs a few provinces. Than Ashdod completly ignores TC and attacks me while I'm still in was with TC. (Note that TC is right in the middle of us). And we spend the next 15 turns fighting around and over TC until I managed to kill him off eventually with superior research.

WL, as per that battle, I didn't expect you to have that many (hidden) stuff there. Especially after losing those Treants and some other stuff the turn before I think?
Anyway, it was a nice battle, and you won it but I think you actually suffered more loses from it than me.

I'd kinda like an underdog nation in the next game.

[WraithLord]

Let there be no doubt. On turn 45 CY's Eriu attacked me in two provinces: 155 + 142.
This in a no diplo game is a one way ticket to war and given the context a fairly stupid move. You may have won the game or had a much better chance had you attacked Ulm instead.

[WraithLord]

Originally Posted by Calahan

I haven't got the turns to hand right now, but was the province next to the Eriu cap the only province you could move to so that you covered the C'tis angle? Wasn't that army all MM2 or MM3? And to me it seemed C'tis's movements were very consistant with simply "grabbing a bit of Eriu", and I saw no intent against Van or Svag (although you may have different intel and view). But if that is the case then it looks like we both had little faith in our neighbours As you moved in reaction to C'tis, and I moved in reaction to your reaction.

Was it province 127?- If so, I moved there b/c earlier I grabbed from Eriu a good chunk of land to the south. When I saw Ctis making a quick grab for these lands I moved this army as sort of a "stop" go no further sign.

[WraithLord]

"Personally, I think you play too cautiously WL. That's something that stuck with me from our former games. I watched every single one of your battle from turn 30 onward. Actually i watched the entire map for quite some time. I had a few dozen crystal orbs and a very extensive scout/spy system going. There was nothing I didn't see.
Also monitoring the rest helped identify you too. "
You're probably right. I play chess a lot and that game taught me the benefits of caution. Perhaps it doesn't translate well to dom...

"WL, as per that battle, I didn't expect you to have that many (hidden) stuff there. Especially after losing those Treants and some other stuff the turn before I think?
Anyway, it was a nice battle, and you won it but I think you actually suffered more loses from it than me. "
Yes the treants were lost b/c of your unexpected attack. But in this battle my losses were not big, my dead commanders were reanimated due to LaD spell. And I got a huge list of "xyz got this and that item" messages

[Executor]

Yeah, I assumed you picked up a nice amount of my items.

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by Executor

I also would blessing of steel too powerful. A handful of flail infantry had no problem dealing with indea 9 from the start under blessings of steel. Having a 24 protection troop is too much from start I think.




Calahan, I noticed instantly that a new player had taken over Svarogia. You even got me scared there for a moment but then I realized there wasn't anything really dangerous in your possession.
As to how Svarogia fell and how I obtained the 3 or rather 4 last VPs;
Shiny cap was the first to go. It was rather easy to take as Shiny had most of his troops in the adjacent fort.




The second fort, Eriu, fell to about 500 teleported troops (gate stone and astral travel) and a few mages and a SC. There was nothing in the fort to protect it and no troops near so it was easy taking.
The other Svarogia fort was Man, which fell to troops, commanders, mages, thugs and SCs. Not too large an army though and it was a tough battle too. Could have lost that one.
The third fort for the win was Al Nadin (C'tis). There was no chance in hell any army could have protected that fort. I had just too many stuff in that army.

Yeah, the Blessing of Iron spell is another misjudged addition IMO. Any new spell that adds battlefield wide buffs has to be added with /extreme/ caution due to the huge force multiplying effect it can instantly have. But to add such spells from turn 1 is just a balance breakingly bad idea IMO. At least make these spell require some fecking reaserch if they are staying (and I hope they're not personally, as adding national battlefield wide buff spells is not a good way to go for any nation), and cost some gems to cast (such as Kailasa's national Quickness spell).



I was wondering why Shiny had that mass stock of troops (vamps mainly) next to their cap? Was there any purpose for that you know?



So did Svar send nothing to defend those VP forts? Did you see no sign of the Master Enslavers? No sign of the Grend Prophet via the Boots of Planes I pinched? No mass arrivals of any A2 cap mages? Nothing at all showed up? No Demon armies? No nothing? How sad

[Valerius]

Originally Posted by WraithLord

But certainly MA Van is a strong nation as should be (nation of fierce vikings should be nothing else).

I agree; it's nice to see them back in strength after a long decline beginning with the great glamour nerf in a patch.

Your build is similar to my EA Van build (bless + scales) except I went with E4N4 instead, which gave me a couple more scales. But I did end up regretting not getting some S on my pretender since I could find absolutely no S mages throughout the game.

[Executor]

No idea why Shiny never used his vamps.
I think his vamp queen met an untimely end in one battle where he tried to RoS or earthquake my large army but failed due to a first turn army of gold and got killed in the process. I had converted the province by that time.

There was an attempt to stop my army at Eriu but it failed. I don't think Svarogia realized I was going for the win until it was too late. No teleported mages also.

As for Man capital, there wasn't much stuff, but there were S mages and the master enslave Arch Devil there. Mainly, I had to defeat my own army there to capture the fort.

As for the boots of plains. **** that was a stupid mistake! My Bane Lord got attacked twice that turn by Horrors (bet you didn't know you could get attacked multiple times by horrors under AC? Well, neither did I! Nearly lost my pretender that way).
Managed to kill a Doom Horror in the first round but got killed in the second by a regular large Horror.
Anyway, I changed his damn battle orders to attack instantly, forgetting Armor of Virtue would not react in this case since it has a retarded AoE1 returning autocast mechanism that takes a turn.

Oh, yes, btw, (this one can go into the Hall of Doh) I also managed to lose Al Kazim to a bunch of tritons. Yes, an equipped buffed Al Kazim lost to about 50 tritons due to a lucky shot and damn poison.

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by WraithLord

Was it province 127?- If so, I moved there b/c earlier I grabbed from Eriu a good chunk of land to the south. When I saw Ctis making a quick grab for these lands I moved this army as sort of a "stop" go no further sign.

Turn 66 - I took out Eriu's cap PD with Zmey's.

Turn 67 - You captured the Eriu fort at 169 with a significant army, and captured 156 with a bunch of Treants (a former Svag province it seems given site search info). While on the same turn I stormed the Eriu cap.

Turn 68 - I capture the Eriu cap and a huge force of yours arrives in 156 (the prov next to Eriu cap), made up of mainly the large force that captured 169. I am then forced to converge a large force on the Eriu cap to hold the walls in case you attack. (I was seriously thinking of attacking Ulm this turn while Shiny still had some life left, but this made me forget all about that)

Turn 69 - Your large force moves away to 164 (I think) and I send my converged force in Eriu out back in the direction of Ulm where they mostly came from.


So it was your large troop arrival in 156 on turn 68 that sent me the wrong vibes.