Exploit question - Page 2

Sombre · #11 December 15th, 2009, 11:10 AM

I agree that most people haven't seen it in action. Largely because it's both obscure and seen as an exploit. I've never done it because to me it's an exploit, which has nothing to do with how powerful it is.

I'd also happily see reverse communions removed, since they're so dependant on meta-game knowledge of unit IDs and if you don't want to use them, just make communions fiddly and arguably buggy. They feel more legit than copying orders over using a gui trick though.

Zeldor · #12 December 15th, 2009, 12:12 PM

I have seen Bogus orders (fire mages) used in MP. And they are as bad as people may fear, if used by good player on proper commanders with proper gear. If you have a mage in PD, it will be owned by a scout + bow. Your big battles will be lost due to some of your mages getting owned by arrows really fast. Of course losses can be limited, but should we be expecting everyone in MP, especially good players, to use exploits like that? I don't think so.

Baalz · #13 December 15th, 2009, 12:27 PM

"if used by good player on proper commanders with proper gear"....who lucked into getting Bogus, has the mages and research to cast charm/hellbind heart, lucks into actually charming the guy with those orders (you know, the one who is firing at the mages trying to charm him), takes the time to forge appropriate gear and get it with the commanders where it can be leveraged...he can easily take out your PD (if all you've got is mages for PD commanders) and unprotected mages. Truth is a 5 gem tower shield will leave your mages very resistant to most arrow fire (which will miss many shots regardless of scripting). A few more gems/smart scripting will leave them effectively immune. Sure, you can come up with some situations where it'll give you a nice advantage, but it's a tough sell to claim it's game breaking.

Zeldor · #14 December 15th, 2009, 12:35 PM

I don't think people are claiming it is. But it's an exploit. It takes some preparations, decent research and good luck to get it. But it can change the result of war, in some situations.

LDiCesare · #15 December 15th, 2009, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sombre

I'd also happily see reverse communions removed, since they're so dependant on meta-game knowledge of unit IDs

The problem is that a reverse communion doesn't require any knowledge of unit IDs. You just have to tell the masters to leave the battlefield or stand not casting spells. The exploit part is when you want to keep the masters to cast spells.

Zeldor · #16 December 15th, 2009, 12:51 PM

The other way

When you want slaves to cast spells.

thejeff · #17 December 15th, 2009, 01:14 PM

That is the other way. You tell the masters to leave, or give them a bow and fire. You don't need to know unit Ids, since once the masters stop casting any slaves will be free to.

Foodstamp · #18 December 15th, 2009, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeldor

I have seen Bogus orders (fire mages) used in MP. And they are as bad as people may fear, if used by good player on proper commanders with proper gear. If you have a mage in PD, it will be owned by a scout + bow. Your big battles will be lost due to some of your mages getting owned by arrows really fast. Of course losses can be limited, but should we be expecting everyone in MP, especially good players, to use exploits like that? I don't think so.

Are you SURE you have seen this used in MP? Did the guy say he used it? The reason I ask is because all it took for me to be publicly accused of using it was using the "Fire at large monsters" command.

This thing is tedious to pull off; I have only done it a couple of times in SP, so it really surprises me to see accusations of it being used thrown around in MP all the time. You got a lot of crap going on in MP to be basing part of your resources and a chunk of your strategy towards charming Bogus.

That is one of the reasons I wouldn't accuse another player of using it, especially in public.

Trumanator · #19 December 15th, 2009, 11:07 PM

Well almost no one bases their strat off it. Its just useful to have.

Foodstamp · #20 December 16th, 2009, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trumanator

Well almost no one bases their strat off it. Its just useful to have.

No but it does take a considerable amount of mage resource which takes away from your overall strategy, and even then there is a chance it will fail. To near guarantee it works would take even more resources.