Whats in a bunker?

[Sniper23]

o.k so they are no good then,time to take out the trash

thanks wdll

[PlasmaKrab]

Added some in a couple of OOBs, more to reflect actual usage than usefulness. Some countries tend to dig in their old tanks a lot to create defensive lines, but I agree with Marcello that they tend to suck a lot in modern warfare.
Think about Switzerland, Austria, Sweden, these countries still use a lot of heavy fortifications like, as I said, stripped-down tank guns placed in concrete or stone structures with large storage and living quarters.

[Sniper23]

i was thinking of making some sinarios so i mit use them there

[Marcello]

"stripped-down tank guns placed in concrete or stone structures"

Generally speaking when tank guns from older tanks are used the turret is retained.
The last swiss fortifications of this type consisted of surplus Centurion turrets placed inside a casemate to give them overhead cover. As I said bunkers armed with large caliber direct fire guns (like the various SPMBT gun bunkers), either fixed or field, seem to be rare in reality.
There are some dedicated fortress guns for indirect fire (like the swiss Bison)and shelters for protection against CB fire (like in North Korea).

[Sniper23]

Marcello said:
"stripped-down tank guns placed in concrete or stone structures"

Generally speaking when tank guns from older tanks are used the turret is retained.
The last swiss fortifications of this type consisted of surplus Centurion turrets placed inside a casemate to give them overhead cover. As I said bunkers armed with large caliber direct fire guns (like the various SPMBT gun bunkers), either fixed or field, seem to be rare in reality.
There are some dedicated fortress guns for indirect fire (like the swiss Bison)and shelters for protection against CB fire (like in North Korea).

so if I use them only use a couple to mimic real life, okay thanks

[Marcello]

"so if I use them only use a couple to mimic real life, okay thanks"

Sorry I did not have the time to explain myself fully. Let's make an example:
OOB 17, unit 198. This is a bunker armed with a 100mm Rapira antitank gun. Here is a picture of the gun
http://svsm.org/gallery/100mm_mt-12/P1020093
In order to put such a thing in a bunker you would have to leave a very large opening for it to enter and leave. And a very large loophole for retaining a meaningful arc of fire.
While I have seen some bunkers built exactly like that they are extremely rare for several good reasons.
Tank turret bunkers are more common, as that was a common way to dispose of older tanks. For example here in Italy many obsolete tanks (Pershing etc) were used in such a fashion to create defensive strongpoint against a Warsaw pact ofensive. The soviets recycled many of their JS tanks to create strongpoints on the Kuriles and such and so on.
One would need a detailed map of such lines to be sure but I would recon that a couple of them on the typical SPMBT map would be just right.
In general the majority of "modern" bunkers (outside the rare cold war defensive line) would be either simple shelters or machineguns positions at most, built out of precast concrete and/or sandbags and such.
As for general effectiviness the germans seemed to be fond of the their Pantherturm bunkers.

[Sniper23]

nice picture, you would have to leave a big opening for it[never thought it was that big].

If tank turrets are more common I might use those more but not too many on the map,would a leopard 1a3 class as an old tank I can make into a tank turret bunker?

"And most bunkers now would be shelter or machine gun positions" So there should be more of them then any other bunker on my field.

If I put infantry inside a shelter bunker will the computer unload them?

[PlasmaKrab]

Sniper23 said:
If tank turrets are more common I might use those more but not too many on the map,would a leopard 1a3 class as an old tank I can make into a tank turret bunker?

Just take whatever old tanks you have lying around, dig a large hole, put your tank at the bottom and pour concrete over the hull!
You can pretty much put any tank (or other AFV) you want, even modern stuff even though it doesn't make sense stores-wise.

"And most bunkers now would be shelter or machine gun positions" So there should be more of them then any other bunker on my field.

You can consider your defensive line as normal troops heavily fortified. Therefore you can keep the same proportion of armor, infantry, artillery, air defense etc. (in fortified equivalent or fortification troops) as when buying for a regular defense. Replace one infantry squad/platoon with one LMG nest/ earthen bunker, infantry support with MG nests or ATGM positions, tanks with cannon bunkers...
You're free to customize, but IMO this could be a working basis for a balanced defence. Just food for thought.

If I put infantry inside a shelter bunker will the computer unload them?

Not sure at all.
Try giving the infantry formation a reaction turn, they may move more easily.

[PanzerBob]

"If I put infantry inside a shelter bunker will the computer unload them?"

In my experience NO, I've had troops in shelters on trench lines survive some heavy arty barrages and only take some suppression. Now direct hits by a deliberate assaults I never seen, and I've never run into a bunker that the computer has loaded with troops.

[Sniper23]

To plasmakrap

I maybe crazy but not that crazy to put something like a abrime in concrete .

As for defense I usually don't use much bunkers but i like your idea of trading a platoon for a bunker.

As for the reaction turn I heard about it in the game guide but what will it do?


And to PanzerBob

okay so I will try and see if anything happens and I have never seen the computer put infantry in bunkers either.

In a regular game how many shelter bunkers do you use most of the time?I don't use them but maybe I should start.