SE5 progress

[Gandalf Parker]

Well I was in email conversation with Aaron which helped to prompt the hints about too much OT, and the suggestions to start stickies on subjects Aaron can zoom into. It seemed better than his suggestion to start another forum for him.

Im hoping he will poke his head in here soon. I think its much easier to spot SE technical subjects.

[David E. Gervais]

Someone needs news about SE5 eh, well as one of the 'Official' Artists working on se5. (I'm building the UI with Aaron) Let me say this,..

The Development is comming along nicely. Aaron got the game engine up and running about 2 months ago. (I can attest to this because I have an early alpha Version) Aaron and I are currently working on inserting all the different UI elements. (He's working, I'm just making his work look good form a visual perspective)

I believe that Aaron said on Yahoo that in a couple more months, he'll be posting some screenshots. (patience is indeed a virtue, but it's a high cost vurtue.)

I know it's not much info, but I am under an NDA after all.

Cheers!

P.S. I wouldn't worry if I were you, SE:V is going to surpass all of your expectations. (It has allready surpassed all of mine.)

Have a great day.

[Raging Deadstar]

I'll take your word for it David, this is indeed good news

[dogscoff]

I'd kill to see a feature-list for the new SE game.

But then I'm just violent...

[Malfador Machinations]

Hi All,

No, I haven't forgotten about you guys! Its just that some questions came up in the Yahoo list and I thought I'd answer them. Since I'm finalizing the data file structure, seemed a good time to get some feedback on the layout from modders.

Here's what I posted in Yahoo about the current layout of weapons in the data file:

Name := Anti - Proton Beam
Description := Focused energy beam used as a medium range weapon.
Picture Number := 18
Maximum Level := 100
Tonnage Space Taken := 30
Tonnage Space Taken Inc Per Level := 0
Tonnage Structure := 30
Tonnage Structure Inc Per Level := 0
Cost Minerals := 50
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 10
Cost Minerals Inc Per Level := 5
Cost Organics Inc Per Level := 0
Cost Radioactives Inc Per Level := 1
Supply Amount Used := 5
Supply Amount Used Inc Per Level := 0
Ordinance Amount Used := 0
Ordinance Amount Used Inc Per Level := 0
Can Be Placed In Ship Sections := Inner Hull, Outer Hull
Component Type List := Technological
General Group := Weapons
Custom Group := 0
Number Of Requirements := 2
Requirements Boolean Evaluation := AND
Requirement 1 Type := Empire Tech Area Level
Requirement 1 Name := Energy Stream Weapons
Requirement 1 Description :=
Requirement 1 Operation := >=
Requirement 1 Amount := 1
Requirement 1 Amount Inc Per Level := 1
Requirement 2 Type := Design Vehicle Type List
Requirement 2 Name := Ship, Base, Satellite, Weapons Platform, Drone
Requirement 2 Description :=
Requirement 2 Operation := None
Requirement 2 Amount := 0
Requirement 2 Amount Inc Per Level := 0
Number Of Abilities := 0
Weapon Type := Direct Fire
Weapon Target Type List := Ship, Base, Planet, Fighter, Satellite, Drone
Weapon Damage Min Point Blank := 15
Weapon Damage Max Point Blank := 20
Weapon Damage Min Dec Per 10 Rng := 5
Weapon Damage Max Dec Per 10 Rng := 5
Weapon Damage Min Inc Per Level := 0.5
Weapon Damage Max Inc Per Level := 0.5
Weapon Maximum Range := 30
Weapon Maximum Range Inc Per Level := 1
Weapon Damage Type := Normal
Weapon To Hit Modifier := 0
Weapon To Hit Inc Per Level := 0
Weapon To Hit Dec Per 10 Rng := 10.0
Weapon Reload Rate MS := 2000
Weapon Display Effect Name := Beam
Weapon Explosion Effect Name := Explosion
Weapon Sound Effect Name := apbeam.wav
Weapon Beam Burn Color := 110, 177, 240
Weapon Beam Duration := 50


But it was pointed out that the weapon damage at range design is not all it could be. So I revised it a bit and came up with:

Weapon Type := Direct Fire
Weapon Target Type List := Ship, Base, Planet, Fighter, Satellite, Drone
Weapon Damage Type := Normal
Weapon At Range Distance Increment := 10.0
Weapon Min Damage At Range := 15.0 10.0 5.0 0.0 0.0
Weapon Max Damage At Range := 20.0 15.0 10.0 5.0 0.0
Weapon To Hit Modifier At Range := -10.0 -20.0 -30.0 -40.0 -50.0
Weapon Min Damage Modifier Formula := [%ListedAmount%] + (([%Level%]-1) * 0.5)
Weapon Max Damage Modifier Formula := [%ListedAmount%] + (([%Level%]-1) * 0.5)
Weapon To Hit Modifier Formula := 0
Weapon Reload Rate MS := 2000
Weapon Display Effect Name := Beam
Weapon Explosion Effect Name := Explosion
Weapon Sound Effect Name := apbeam.wav
Weapon Beam Burn Color := 110, 177, 240
Weapon Beam Duration := 50


So instead of those pesky Inc Per Level fields, we would now have formulas to come up with the new values. Of course, speed may be an issue, so it will require some performance testing once its in and working (no guarantees that formulas will survive that).

Progress is good on the game. The basic engine is up and running and I'm busy going through and getting screens working (which is a major time consumer with 50+ screens).

At present there's still a debate about Research and Intelligence. Right now I'm moving it back to an SE3 style with percentage allocation for research tech areas and percentage intelligence spending against each empire. With all the pros and cons, the final decider for me was that percentage allocation method greatly reduces the micromanagement (as you only need to visit these screens occasionally once the allocations have been set).

So if you have suggestions for the game, please post them. Nothing is set in stone, as the SE4 beta testers will confirm. SE4 changed radically during its beta test. And I do read the ideas posted here. In fact I copy all of the ones that catch my eye to a huge Word document.

Of course, I can't guarantee that everything will make it in. But even simple ideas can have a tremendous effect.

Aaron

[Fyron]

The ability to use exponents in the formulas is a must. Otherwise, we can not set up diminishing returns at higher tech levels very well...

[ June 14, 2004, 18:29: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[Baron Munchausen]

You still haven't corrected 'Ordinance' I see... The word for ammunition is 'Ordnance' without the 'i' in it. Both words are from the same root, but 'ordinance' is used to designate laws or customs (civil or religious) while 'ordnance' is used to designate military supplies.

Can the 'cost per level' entries take negative numbers so we can have decreasing costs as technology advances? Can tonnage also take negative numbers so size be reduced as tech levels advance?

And btw, just a sudden thought, could we have 'intermittent' beams as well as continuous? It would be cool if you could figure out how to make something 'pulsed' rather like the phasers in Star Trek II. Those had a really satisfyingly believable sense of 'particle beam' about them.

[Suicide Junkie]

Weapon Min Damage At Range := ...
...
Weapon Min Damage Modifier Formula := [%ListedAmount%] + (([%Level%]-1) * 0.5)

Would it not be simpler to just add:
[%range%]

And then use:
Weapon Min Damage := 15 - ([%range%]/2) + (([%level%]-1) * 0.5)
Produces:
15 @ range 0-1
14 @ range 2-3
13 @ range 4-5
...

Then you don't need to specify all the "damage at range"s.
If you want a step function you could have a round-to-integer function:

Weapon Min Damage := 15 - 5*round([%range%]/10) + (([%level%]-1) * 0.5)
Produces:
15 @ range 0 to 9
10 @ range 10 to 19
5 @ range 20 to 29


PS:
You will definitely want to only parse the formulae once each if possible.

Having a separate formula.txt with named equations to use with parameters given by the particular components could make this simpler.

Most stock components use very similar formulae, and reusing them would probably help.

[ June 14, 2004, 18:49: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

[Puke]

Originally posted by Baron Munchausen:
And btw, just a sudden thought, could we have 'intermittent' beams as well as continuous? It would be cool if you could figure out how to make something 'pulsed' rather like the phasers in Star Trek II. Those had a really satisfyingly believable sense of 'particle beam' about them.

of course you can. you can either edit the beam graphics to make it look pulsed (just like now) or you can create a Version of the weapon that does less damage but fires faster. notice the reload time in turns is replaced by reload time in miliseconds, so you could have a 1/4 power beam that fires twice a second instead of a full power beam that fires every other second.

Can the 'cost per level' entries take negative numbers so we can have decreasing costs as technology advances? Can tonnage also take negative numbers so size be reduced as tech levels advance?

that would be cool, but it would have to be formulaic so that it could not reduce past a given number. should be exponential (as mentioned) so that cost could either raise or lower approaching but not passing some number.

[ June 14, 2004, 18:59: Message edited by: Puke ]

[dogscoff]

Supply Amount Used := 5
Ordinance Amount Used := 0

Supply and ammo counted seperately?
*dogscoff does an arcane little dance of glee.

Fantastic! Of course a little help with the resulting micromanagement would be nice...