The FASTBOAT Patch page.

[Suhiir]

I assure you I very much value your work.

But the trouble (as always) when dealing with contemporary (and sometimes past) equipment is getting solid data. For as "simple" as WinSPMBT may appear to some, those that deal with the actual data that defines units know it's anything but behind the scenes. A simple date change may effect multiple OOBs and several scenarios which may then require updating.

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

If your in no rush I'll keep going as I'm doing with the time I have. But as a "heads up" just spent the last couple of hours reverifying my data and trying to "stay on point" in the brevity department.

We'll see how that worked out in the INDIA section (Which I referred to above.) with what others I have to this point for Part 2 of this Thread.

It will be concerning the first tank I offered for India and one of the first I posted so long ago-yes-the ARJUN (Series.). Nothing too earth shattering with the biggest changes to the ARJUN Mk-1A.

I'm done.

Regards,
Pat

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

SPMBT/MBT’s Part 2
I hope to finish the rest of the 2018/2019 MBT data with this Part 2 (2/16/2020 I will need a Part 3.). Again I realize some of what will be posted here has been acted on but, then this is not why they appear here as I noted in an earlier. All the below sourced from the MBT Thread.

From Page 81 Post 802
A1. ALGERIA/ADD/JUN 2018/T-90SA/COPY UNIT 027/WITH SHTORA-1//
Article is from May, its indicating system is already installed on some tanks. June seems like a safe month, however, if you wish to be more conservative then I recommend NLT OCT.

C1. ALGERIA/CHANGE/UNIT 027/T-90S/TORD T-90SA//
All Algerian T-90S (Standard export version.) were modified somewhat for desert warfare to include, I know, AC (But remember folks AC isn't for the crew but for the electronics.) and therefore designated T-90SA.
http://www.armyrecognition.com/may_2..._53005161.html

From Page 81 Post 808/I wanted to keep these together.
This follows the "tact" as I discussed last week or whenever I posted PART I. I just pulled this off the "wire" so again Croatia will have to wait, as this article impacts both Brazil and will "dove tail" to Uruguay. I know not many players probably play these OOB's but, that doesn't mean we (I) should ignore them, after all my motto is "One World One OOB". Let's get to it...

BRAZIL/CHANGE/M-41C CAXIAS/UNIT 007/END DATE 12/1996 VICE 12/2025// There is some evidence to support this date when the first LEOPARD tanks went into service for the Brazilian Army. These tanks were used for training purposes both before (Earlier mods.) and up to, for the sake of argument, concerning the month, 12/2009 as deemed obsolete. So that last date gives you an out however I'm feeling 80% sure of the date as submitted. I know it's not the best, but the current situation isn't correct.

Now we "dove tail"...

URAGUAY/ADD/M-41C CAXIAS/USE BRAZILIAN UNIT 007/START DATE 12/2019/LEAVE NAME UNCHANGED FOR NOW/REDESINATION UNKNOWN AT THIS TIME/WHEN ANNOUCED (IF) IT'LL BE EASIER TO FIND AND FIX// I've not seen anything on name change or any upgrades to at least the current M-41UR BULLDOG that has slightly better armor numbers. These tanks will by Brazil be fully maintained before delivery.

These tanks will replace the last of the M-24 CHAFFEE tanks in service with the Uruguayan Army. So...

URAGUAY/CHANGE/M-24UR CHAFFEE/UNIT 005/END DATE 06/2019 VICE 12/2015// I feel that's a good overall date, it generally takes a little longer to "pull something out than put it in" and this will allow more than enough time to retrain the M-24 crews to man the "new" M-41C Brazilian received tanks.

I think that about covers it and I need to get ready for work. Again, a "composite" ref.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/nove...ayan_army.html

From Page 81 Post 810
News first then we'll take a journey into the OOB.
FYI HEADLINE/CROATIA/M-84A4 SNIPER and M-84D TO BE UPGRADED TO THE M-95 DEGMAN LEVEL//TRACKING/GUESS/SHOULD HAVE UNITS UPGRADED AND IN THE FIELD BY 10/2020/IF THIS HOLDS TRUE, THAT WOULD MARK THE END DATES FOR THOSE TWO M-84 VARIENTS// Budget was approved in 02/2018. Assume work has begun if budget is on the Calendar year, if not and they are on a standard Fiscal year, work should have started around 10/2018 or 11/2018.

FYI/HEADLINE/CROATIA/M-95 DEGMAN/APPARENTLY THEY SEEK TO UPGRADE IT TO MEET NATO STANAG REQUIRMENTS. THEY HAVE ALREADY BEEN COLLABRATING WITH SWISS RUAG TO DEVELOP A SMALL CALIBAR (L44?) 120mm MG TO ALSO MEET NATO REQUIRMENTS/TRACKING/THEY ARE ON A UNKNOWN TIMELINE TO GET THIS DONE FROM NATO/GUESS/06/2021//

I'm to do this in as close to the listing in the OOB as possible.

First CROATIAN M-84 progression/hierarchy: M-84, M-84A (Both out of Service.), M-84A4 SNIPER, M-84D and M-95 DEGMAN.

YUGOSLOVIA (Built in the State of CROATIA) developed the M-84 as an improved version of the SOVIET era T-72M1M export version. This build issue will cause a start date change for one tank, but, if not you at least know what I was thinking at the time.

Alright here we go...

CROATIA/CHANGE/M-95 DEGMAN/UNIT 008/TI/GSR 40 VICE VISION 35/DELETE LAHAT/DELETE 12.7mm M87 AAMG/ADD Samson RWS 12.7mm HMG//Based on the refs to be provided with the builder one provided directly below, the argument can be made that this tank has a DETECTION RNG. OF >4000m/RECOGNITION RNG. >2000m it is considered an advanced 2nd GEN System. LAHAT was never exported to CROATIA and no site I've come across (And I don't use WIKI anything.) mentions any CROATIAN tank being armed with the LAHAT. Further ref. is also directly below the first one as they are exclusive to this tank. Dates covered 1990 - 2017 for SIPRI search.
Finally I chose this tank because the ERA is where it should be.
http://ddsv.hr/download/Tenk_Degman_engleski.pdf
All optional equipment was acted upon to include FCS & 1200HP German engine etc.
http://armstrade.sipri.org/armstrade...e_register.php

Israel "Delivered" "Weapon" "Order" "Delivered"
R: Croatia 2 Hermes-450 UAV 2006 2007 2
8 UT-25/UT-30 IFV turret 2017 HRK94 m ($14.8 m) deal; UT-30MK2 version for 6 AMV IFV; delivery planned 2018

Reporting to SIPRI is governed by Treaties and International Law among the factors they use.

CROATIA/CHANGE/M-84 & M-84A/UNITS 012 & 013/END DATE 12/2007 VICE 12/2025//All previous active T-84 mods were upgraded to the M-84A4 SNIPER standard by 2008.

CROATIA/DELETE/M-95 DEGMAN/UNIT O15//If anything these might have represented the two prototype tanks that were produced and not put into service.

CROATIA/CHANGE/M-84D/UNIT 020/DELETE 12.7 M2 (SLAP)/ADD 12.7mm M2 CROWS RWS//

CROATIA/DELETE/M-84D/UNIT 021/REDUNDANT TO UNIT 020/AGAIN NO LAHAT//

CROATIA/CHANGE/M-95 DEGMAN/UNIT 023/USE MODIFIED UNIT 008 IF ADAPTED AS BASE/DELETE 12.7mm M87 AAMG/ADD Samson RWS 40mm AGL//

CROATIA/DELETE/M-94 DEGMAN/UNIT 024/REDUNDANT//

I can find no evidence that any of these tanks had a "mid-life" upgrade of any kind. Besides other factors, this drove some of the above.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/febr...nks_fleet.html
https://www.israeldefense.co.il/en/node/33033
http://tanknutdave.com/the-yugoslavi...r-m-84-series/
https://www.militaryfactory.com/armo...p?armor_id=629

Ref. 3 does a nice job of breaking these tanks down but more importantly along with Ref. 4 to a lesser degree, discuss the various mods across the countries that operated the M-84.

Doing the best I can.

INDIA/CHANGE/ARJUN Mk-1/UNIT 020/CHANGE/END JAN 2025//
This MBT is still very much in service, currently with the 43RD Tank Regiment in western India.
https://www.ndtv.com/blog/why-the-ar...et-yet-1797209
https://www.janes.com/article/80893/...pacific-es18d3
(This Ref. 1 near the bottom discusses the fact that LAHAT failed testing and in meeting India’s tactical requirements. India will develop their own ATGW. Ref. dated Jan 2018.)

INDIA/CHANGE/ARJUN Mk-1A/UNIT 021/CHANGE/START JAN 2021/VISION/TI/GSR 50/REMOVE LAHAT/FC 50/STABILIZER 6/ERA (All) 18/ROF 7/USES SAME RWS AS ARJUN Mk-2/TRACK WIDTH MINE PLOUGH (TWMP) SEEMS TO BE STANDARD/BASE/ARJUN Mk-2/UNITS 022/023//
This MBT was delayed. As you will have noted from the above refs. They both end up talking about the Mk-1 to the MK-2 (Only in ref. 2). The ARJUN MK-1A has incorporated 72 out of the ~97 improvements the Army has required for the ARJUN Mk-2. The above changes are what’s on the ARJUN Mk-2 at this time. None of the above are items of issue currently delaying the ARJUN Mk-2. The tank will make its public appearance at DefExpo India 2020, I believe on 20 Feb.

A separate issue appears to be that this MBT is also (Can be.) equipped to fire both a Thermo Baric (TB) and Penetration Cum Blast (PCB) round.

Can those rounds be modeled?

https://www.newindianexpress.com/sta...y-2073063.html
https://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...n-2073023.html
https://weaponews.com/news/65357533-...able-bull.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/dece...roduction.html

INDIA/CHANGE/ARJUN Mk-2/UNIT 022/ROF 7/If the above TB and or PCB rounds can be modeled, then this MBT should also have those rounds//

INDIA/DELETE/ARJUN Mk-2/UNIT 023/NO LAHAT/WITH OPTION 2 FOLLOWING BELOW/CHANGE/ROF 7//Alright Option 2, retain this MBT until such time as India needs to develop its own ATGW. But remove it from regular play if retained.

New pictures will be submitted for UNITS 021/022 as they currently reflect the ARJUN Mk-1/Mk-2. In outward appearance they're the same. Also added a better (Maybe.) ARJUN Mk-1 picture as well. It'll be the last one.

Trying this in a separate post.

STATUS UPDATE for ARJUN Mk-2: The weight of the ARJUN Series has been one of the biggest issues concerning the Army from the start. The update here is that they just very recently announced they have redesigned the chassis and reduced the overall weight by 3 tons. I know the newer more effective ERA on this tank (And on the Mk-1A.) shed another ton just about. This makes me hopeful that we will actually see this MBT in the game.

From Page 85 Post 849
JAPAN/ADD/TYPE 16 MCV 8x8/START 06 2017/C4/SPEED 100km/h (62.1 mph)/4x2 GRENADE LAUNCHERS TURRET MOUNTED/RADIO 91/TI/GSR 50/MODIFIED L7 105mm/L52 JSW/ROUNDS 55 SEE REF. 1 FOR TYPES/RS COAX Type 74 7.62mm/RS Mid Turret 12.7mm M2HB HMG/FCS 50/LASER R/F 22/STABILISER 6/SURVIBILITY 5/STEEL/HEAT USE ITALY B1-B CENTAURA UNIT 030/ERA NONE MENTIONED/SUBMITTED AS UPARMORED VERSION//The design was based on the SADF ROOIKAT and ITALY's CENTURO. The MCV was designed to replace the TYPE 74 MBT of which that process has already begun. Due to cost issues of the TYPE 10 during development and sanctions limiting the JGSDF to 600 tanks, the MCV was seen as a cheap alternative to supplement their tank branch. First off the FCS is believed to be derived from the TYPE 10. The MG is similar to the one used on the TYPE 74 but, modified with the addition of integrated thermal sleeve and fume-extractor the importance of this goes to the MG STABILITY has already been discussed with the recent SADF submissions (Added as submitted in Part 1.). It does feature a unique muzzle brake/compensator, consisting of rows of nine holes bored into the barrel in a spiral formation see picture on Ref. 1. I've not seen that on any MBT MG to date.
Researched contemporary peer game units SOUTH AFRICA ROOIKAT II UNIT 017, ITALY B1-B CENTURO UNIT 030, JAPAN TYPE 10 UNIT 022 & TYPE 74 KAI UNIT 027. Like the TYPE 10 the ARMOR/STEEL composition and thickness are CLASSIFIED. The same as a side note concerns the TYPE 10 ammo, all we know is that we've (USA) has noted "it is highly effective". I've not come across anything to indicate that the MCV ammo is, I will assume it is of a high quality and effective though.
Relying heavily on Refs. 1 & 2 because they are NEWER and RELIABLE. The next is the same but not updated.
http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/mo...n-type-16-mcv/
https://www.janes.com/article/74061/...ility-dsei17d4
(NOTE LAST PARA & Mr. Foss of JANE'S is a well known writer.)
For further info:
https://www.armyrecognition.com/japa...res_video.html
(NOTE Shows JAPAN as a USER not PROTOTYPE.)

From Page 94 Post 940:
RUSSIA/T-90M/UNIT 059/START JUN 2020 vice OCT 2018.// This should get the job done, hopefully. I first posted on this MBT late in 2017 or early in 2018 I believe, having first been spotted participating in a Russian exercise. The T-90M which I've been watching from the start. It is currently still in trials so a date change will be required. (Follow the ref. chain below as they have now been updated.)
https://www.armyrecognition.com/july...uisitions.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/russ...res_video.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/febr...sian_army.html
(From the ref. Dated FEB 2018, "According to the Russian Company Uralvagonzavod, the latest modernization of the main battle tank T-90, called T-90M will enter in service with the Russian army in the next few months.")
https://thediplomat.com/2019/03/russ...rials-in-2019/
https://www.almasdarnews.com/article...ew-t-90m-tank/
(This last ref. from this past SEP. indicates the Russian Army did not receive its first T-90M until JUN 2019.)
https://www.defenseworld.net/news/25...y#.Xav6qm5Fzoo
(This ref. SEP 2019 is saying they just got their first one in SEP 2019.)

From Page 93 Post #924
UKRAINE/ADD/T-64 BULAT M17/COPY UNIT O32 T-64BM BULAT/CHANGE/START JUN 2018/EW 2 APS/RADIO 90/VISION TI/GSR 45/FC 45/STABILIZER 5/ERA HF 16/HS 16/HR 0/TF 16/TS 16/TR 0/TOP 16/USED UNITS 032 T-64BM BULAT/UNIT 063 T-84 OPLOT+/UNIT 064 T-84 OPLOT-M AS BASELINE UNITS //First off it looks like UNIT 032 should also be equipped with the same EW as the T-64 BULAT M17. The T-64 BULAT’s are the main frontline tanks in Ukraine’s Eastern sector and were in need of further modernization based on combat experience, even though they showed themselves as more than a match against the rebel’s T-72 tanks. I don’t think up to the ERA numbers there’s any problems here. And I really feel very comfortable about those ERA numbers as this represents a much improved NOZH (KNIFE) ERA. It essentially falls between NOZH II and the DUPLEX ERA’s. I’ll have to find my original posts on this tank as I think they had better information in them.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/febr...mor_plant.html
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/bu...-russia-112166
https://www.armyrecognition.com/augu...t-64_mbts.html
https://www.janes.com/article/86319/...upgraded-t-64s
https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-def...t64-tanks.html
https://defence-blog.com/army/russia...er-t-72b3.html
https://issuu.com/ukrainian_defense_...cs/udr-02-2017 (See pages 13–14 and 16–17 for this ref.)

From Page 71 Post 702
CHANGE/UNIT 538/ABRAMS M1A2 SEP V3/START DATE 4/117 to 5/120//
Prototypes (6) to the USA by end of this month, or Oct. (From the time this was posted.)
https://www.armyrecognition.com/sept...tle_tanks.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/unit..._11710154.html

From Page 71 Posts 703/704
USA/ADD/JAN 2018/M1A2 SEP V2/COPY UNIT 517/CHANGE EW 0 TO EW 2/4 TROPHY/CHANGE 50 CAL AAMG TO 50 CAL CROWS II RWS// (My edit “today”, this was/is a tough decision the RWS was addressed and fixed per Post 704. The issue is TROPHY. Under an “urgent equipment order” while TROPHY was finishing testing, the USA decided to equipment ONE combat brigade with it prior to a rotational deployment to Europe. But in the game you just can’t equip a brigade you have to equip the whole fleet. This just isn’t reality, so to copy the above UNIT 517 wouldn’t be a waste of time to get ahead of the TROPHY issue, which might happen by years end or the next year. But it shouldn’t be game ready now and I don’t think it is.)
ALSO...
USA/CHANGE/UNITS 517 M1A2 SEP V2 & 538 M1A2 SEP V3/CHANGE 50 CAL AAMG TO 50 CAL CROWS II RWS.//
When submitted in Patch Post #2 for the 2012/2013 campaign 18 February 2013 under MBT's...A1 M1A2 SEP V2 the unit was submitted to have the 50 CAL CROWS II RWS. For all the Patch Posts I've submitted, I've maintained a hard copy of each. When the Patch comes out I do a line item check against what I submitted and what actually was put in. Reading from my "crib" notes in the margin are the following...
"TI/GSR 50" with check mark and "THANKS 898/899 NEW BRADLEY" (A reminder which I posted to Don later.) this tells me it was originally put in the game with the CROWS II RWS. Am I off base here and I missed it then? Or was it changed afterwards? I think however there's a performance difference between the two 50 CAL weapons in the game. A note about the ref., in the title it does say..."...tanks fitted with..." and not "will be" "soon to be" "in the future" "expected to be" "planned to be" etc. etc.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/octo...on_system.html
https://breakingdefense.com/2016/03/...sraeli-trophy/
https://scout.com/military/warrior/A...ecti-101454662
https://www.defensetech.org/2017/06/...h-chief-hints/

The last two USA UNITS represents the start of the ABRAMS nightmare. I have had to go back OVER 30 Pages of Posts to “Recapture” this data and to see if there have been any updates to what I’ve posted thus far. I haven’t find any yet to date except where noted in () other than attached to the refs.

I’m pretty sure the Algerian, Japanese, Ukrainian (With a compromise on the ERA with Don.), and possibly the USA units have been addressed.

I have not the time to verify the OOB’s, sorry, we’re going into a third week of two major security exercises as announced for planning purposes for delayed base access for those with base access.

The whole team has done really well in the first exercise, it’s time to finish strong on the next one.

But again, as far as I can find all the above is still correct and relevant.

I had taken a few hours to list everything posted thus far and what will now end with a PART III.

And this ONLY covers the MBT’s. I found doing this “donkey backwards” that I posted A LOT of inputs across the Threads. But this will be the longest of them all by far I think.

At least I won’t have to put them back into their “Home Threads” like I normally do!

Before anyone says anything about that last sentence, just let me live in that pretend world of “ignorant bliss” please!?! Yeah "donkey backwards", someone just shoot me if it happens again!?!


Regards
Pat

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

Hopefully this works...










Sending them via alternate method. See previous Post.

And can you delete this worthless post?

Regards,
Pat

[DRG]

A couple do. most don't. Don't worry about it if I think I need better photos I know how to find them and as well the ones that do show are incorrect.. The second link from the end you have as a 1a is clearly marked II right on the tank's front left fender



And this link
https://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...n-2073023.html

Also claims the photo is a 1A but it is also clearly marked as a II...... and it's probably the same tank as the other photo

[IMG][/IMG]

Seeing as how convoluted this has become I am going to go out on a limb and say the 1A and the II are the same tank with "1A" being the working prototype name and in reality, what we should have is one unit named Arjun Mk IA/II

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

I would recommend keeping them separate. A couple of the sources are indicating that the ARJUN Mk-1 will be upgraded to the ARJUN Mk-1A standard during depot over haul as funds become available.

And there are a couple of issues with the ARJUN Mk-2 besides the outstanding "mystery" improvements NOT made on the ARJUN Mk-1A. I don't know how you shed just over 3 tons of weight on the chassis and maintain its overall strength to mount the same body onto it.

Unless they've developed a stronger steel composite we don't know about, it's very possible we could see a "smaller" MBT. As an example just because the Japanese TYPE 10 is a small tank doesn't mean I want to fight against it.

I can quite honestly see the ARJUN Mk-2 "dovetail" right into the LONG hoped for FMBT Program India has wanted, where the ARJUN Mk-2 will become the prototype MBT for that project.

ARJUN was always meant to get them to FMBT. The local political situation and finances have driven them to the ARJUN Mk-1A whether it takes them to the ARJUN Mk-2 is still up in the air, given India's history dealing with these tanks.

Remember it took them 30yrs. just to get them to the ARJUN (Prototype) and about another 3-5 years before we had the ARJUN Mk-1.

It would be more expediate in the mid term and financially sound, to just upgrade the ARJUN Mk-1 to the Mk-1A standard.

We don't need to follow India as much as we need to follow Pakistan. Why?

Remember I posted this within the last couple of years, the Ukraine and Pakistan have already signed the papers to in a sense
co-develop the OPLOT-P. That will drive India's ARJUN/FMBT issue more then the rest of it in my opinion.

Can you just edit the pictures since they'll be B&W anyway? Don't know never tried any of that myself.

Regards,
Pat

[RC4]

Dont worry, I follow Pakistan. I have a complete changed Orbat for them. I am testing it to get it right.

The Pak government is investing on:
-more Al-Zarrar conversions from T59MII
-Upgrade all their T85IIAP
-Upgrade T80UD/T84 hybrid with some Oplot equipment
-new build Al-Khalid I (improved) (new mechanized Division forming)
-new T125-IIM ammo

Thanks

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

SPMBT Patch Post 2018/2019 Part 3
This I think will be the last MBT resubmission from that same Thread. First the depth some of us go to, too test and or verify our thoughts, sources and concerns. I would like to demonstrate that, as is the case here, for just one MBT. That being Ukraine’s OPLOT-M. I was seeing in game play a 3:1 kill ratio in favor of the T-72B3M/B4 against the OPLOT-M. This would be an incorrect conclusion based on everything we know about these tanks in the end.
From Page 85 Post 842.

A. Para 1 “I relied on my evaluations from the recent testing done, looked at the feedback I received from others, rechecked old refs and found new ones and checked my conclusions against its peer Russian T-90A UNIT 050, its main rival T-72B3M/B4 when I play the against the AI.”

B. Para 3 “As with the two already listed these next where also used to evaluate my numbers for STEEL/HEAT/ERA & STABILISER as submitted below. They are (The ones I've submitted or changed will have "*" by the name.) THAILAND *OPLOT-M (T) UNIT 019, UKRAINE T-84 UNIT 059, RUSSIAN *T-80BMV UNIT 046, SWEDEN *STRV-122A UNIT 358 (This tank was chosen because it is my firm belief there is no better "TOP" protected tank in the world. Acted as a check against me as the others did. This came about from tests conducted on their stock of Russian tanks with STRIX which proved devastating to them. Also these LEOPARD tanks were made to order for SWEDEN and NOT stock tanks. The "STEEL" for the turret hatch alone was increased just shy of 2 feet thick which means the surrounding "TOP" area has to be even thicker as all hatches are recessed to avoid such issues as over pressurization etc. no different than on a Submarine and verified by my co-worker "JAKE" (Helped us on some BRADLEY issues we were looking into in the past.) the ABRAMS/BRADLEY Driver/Gunner extraordinaire. For further see the FB Patch Thread "Patch Post #2 for the 2013/2014 Campaign"), USA M1A2 SEP V1 UNIT 318, M1A1HA+ UNIT 484, *MIA2 SEP V2 UNIT 517, and *M1A2 SEP V3".

C. All the Test and Assessment Posts can be found below.
“From the tests the average Kill RATIO stands at 3:1 win favoring the T-72B3M/B4. All the issues have already have been covered with the solutions to help counter the situation and acknowledged.
PG. 82 Posts 813/814/815 (Last Para) and 816.
PG. 83 Posts 824 and 830
PG. 84 Post 832.”

D. To “my” testers, John (Imp), Aeraaa, zovs66 and jivemi. I THANK YOU!!

NOW TO BUSINESS...

From Page 84 Post 837 This was just one of those issues that just came up out of nowhere…
Well I have an issue I believe, I've sorted out, maybe. It concerns the Russian T-80 Series. One will be an "ADD" the other a "CHANGE" of the "START" as it's at least a year early. The issue is that the Russian T-80B/BV/U tanks received an upgrade. As the T-80BV is a real tank and is already in the game, I purpose that the upgraded tank be entered as the T-80BV1.

NOW THE ABOVE WILL BE LIMITED TO DATE CHANGES FOR THE FOLLOWING 3 TANKS AFTER DEEPER RESEARCH AND RE-READING THE ARMY REC. REFS. (THE WORDING WAS A LITTLE CONFUSING AT FIRST.) (An obvious EDIT "on the fly" at that time. 2/25/2020.)

CHANGE/RUSSIA/T-80B/UNIT 621/END DATE 12/1992 VICE 12/1985//
All T-80B tanks in service were upgraded to the T-80BV until production ceased on that tank in 1992. I cannot find any reference to the existence of the T-80B1/UNITS 622 & 676 as entered in the game of which I believe are redundant to the T-80B.

DELETE/RUSSIA/T-80B1/UNITS 622 & 676/CANNOT VERIFY THEY EXIST//
As noted above and as indicated by the refs shown and others in a deeper web search.
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t80b.htm

CHANGE/RUSSIA/T-80BV/UNIT 039/END DATE 12/2025 VICE 12/1992//
I can't seem to find anything to say these tanks are no longer in service. I fully understand a great many of them are in storage, but again the refs provided for this tank and others seem to indicate many are still operational and they are the platform from which the T-80BVM are derived from. View "Variants" section of ref. 1. Ref. 2 shows Russia still using them at bottom of ref. "Users" section.
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t80b.htm
https://www.armyrecognition.com/russ..._13007173.html

CHANGE/RUSSIA/T-80BVM/UNIT 046/START DATE 10/2018 VICE 06/2017//
Date based on following from ref. 1 "Russia’s T-80BV main battle tank has been upgraded to T-80BVM standard to feature the capability of firing depleted uranium shells, the Defense Ministry said in the bulletin ‘The Russian Army in Comparison’ published on 20 December." Also note last para from ref. 1 which addresses some of what I submitted above.
Ref. 2 production begins in March 2018.
Ref. 3 Dated 02 July 2018, identifies the first units to be equipped with the T-80BVM.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/dece...um_shells.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/weap..._t-80_mbt.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/july...he_arctic.html

Others on the T-80...
http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/coldwar/USSR/T-80.php
http://id3486.securedata.net/fprado/armorsite/T-80U.htm
(For the above see production chart on first page.)

THE NEXT IS DONE.

From Page 85 Post 842
UKRAINE/OPLOT-M/UNIT 064/CHANGE/STEEL/HF 75 vice 72/HR 10 vice 8/TOP 10 vice 7/HEAT/110 vice 104/HS 45 vice 40/TR 20 vice 18/ERA/HF 20 vice 15/HS 18 vice 15/TF 20 vice 15/TS 18 vice 15/TOP 20 vice 15/STABILISER 6 vice 5// My key tanks here where the T-84, OPLOT-M (T), T-90A, T-72B3M/B4, T-80BMV and STRV-122A. We know or should know the following by now, the T-90A is it's peer tank, the tank was RESET to the "-M" with the Hull strengthened and the Turret was newly built for this tank, ERA is better than the T-90A and the KBA3 MG has a first round hit probability tested to at least 94%. All this was born out in the evaluations during testing from the refs supplied in the posts and more as described above.

THAILAND/OPLOT-M/UNIT 019/CHANGE/NAME/OPLOT-T vice OPLOT-M/STABILISER 4 vice 3/STEEL-HEAT-ERA to match UKRAINE OPLOT-M UNIT 064 AS REVISED ABOVE// Though at the time, OPLOT-M was primarily used in referring to this tank, I'm assuming to avoid confusion. The refs. are using OPLOT-T now as has the THAI Army for some time now. The only difference between these tanks were a small handful of internal issues i.e. AC (Ukraine would add this feature to based on THAI feedback to theirs.) and other tropical related matters. I believe the lesser FCS related numbers are probably good assuming the Ukrainians didn't clear them (And they haven't. 2/25/2020.) to receive the full FCS to the level of their own "home" tanks. This is not an unusual practice in the arms trade. That being said, if it's decided to fully match the hopefully revised Ukrainian OPLOT-M then I see no real issue there either.
(This MBT is fine as already corrected. If I was to change one thing however, it might be to reduce VISION TI/GSR 45 vice 50 currently. I leave this to you to decide. 2/25/2020.)

From Page 85 Posts 844/845
USA/M1A2 SEP V3/UNIT 538/CHANGE/START DATE 06/2020 vice 10/2017/MBT IS CURRENTLY STILL IN FIELD/OP EVAL TESTING// The date currently entered is when the first six production models came off the line. These would eventually (And more obviously.) and as the refs are showing, went to the USA units assigned to test it. The significance of the DID entry I pointed to makes sense as it indicated the first 45 of these tanks would be completed, I believe it was in March this year. You'll note the rest of the upgrade completion dates go beyond my "recommended" one above. The test and Prototypes would fill a unit by then or maybe a little earlier. I've already deleted all the refs. before I realized we had a problem here, so you'll have to use my last post and those refs supplied as a start point. Due note the latest is from the Army website as are 2 others.
https://www.army.mil/article/172984/...ound_at_a_time https://www.army.mil/article/214733/...proving_ground
https://www.army.mil/article/214733/...proving_ground

From Page 86 Posts 858/860 (Note: I have already edited the original data to reflect the correction made in Post 860* for the DELETION, to UNIT 649* vice UNIT 640. 2/24/2090.)

USA/CHANGE/RESET/M1A2 SEP/UNITS 316 & 647/CHANGE/M1A2 SEP MCRS/UNITS 653 & 654/ALL TO/START OCT 2008/END DEC 2025/TI/GSR 50 vice 40/FC 55 vice 50/STEEL HF 70 vice 65/HS 18 vice 12/HR 10 vice 9/HEAT TF 150 vice 147/TS 50 vice 48// Unlike the M1A1 FEP, the M1A2 SEP received a 3rd GEN armor upgrade this includes a D/U pkg. as well. I "threaded the needle" for FOC based on the conflicting data. However it should be noted it's NOT out of line based on what I posted concerning the M1A2 SEP V3 almost being 3 yrs. into its OPEVAL as we speak. Also the last order placed for the SEP was in mid/late 2005. That being said, I leaned a little more on the following from DID (Last Ref.) entries AUG 29/08 and JUN 20/05. Overall the SEP program to date must viewed as incremental improvements in all areas. And I really like the picture, things should be seen doing things.

USA/DELETE/M1A2 SEP V1/UNITS 318 & 649*/SAVE THE PICTURE WE HAVE LATE MODEL ABRAMS "FLOATING IN THE SKY" THAT CAN USE IT// For the reasons stated above and below within the Refs. I have seen Refs to indicate the M1A1 AIM being tagged with V1 and V2 attached to the name. Also M1A1 AIM were all REMANUFACTED tanks for the record.

USA/CHANGE/M1A2 SEP V2/M1A2 SEP 2-T/UNITS 517 & 537 RESPECTIVLY/FC 55 vice 50/BASED ON M1A2 SEP V3 FC 60/NOTE I MISSED UNIT 537 WHEN I SUBMITTED REVISED START FOR UNIT 517 (06/2020 I BELIEVE FROM POST 845) SHOULD MATCH// Again we see the progression more clearly now between the variants.
http://www.benning.army.mil/armor/eA...une1996web.pdf
(In 1996 the plan, pg. 11 and see Fig. 3 pg. 14.)
http://www.dote.osd.mil/pub/reports/...rmy/99m1a2.pdf
(In 2000 testing issues and failures experienced during and beyond 1999.)
http://www.dote.osd.mil/pub/reports/...amsM1A2SEP.pdf
https://asc.army.mil/docs/pubs/alt/2...est_200101.pdf
(2001 Another overview and analysis.)
(In 2002 testing continues with minor issues, progress being made.)
https://www.forecastinternational.co...DACH_RECNO=534
(2003 Commanders CITV. Cap. & Production Plan.)
https://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/wsh/22.pdf
(2005 Conversion moves on it will be seen FOC not until Units are in "PROGRAM STATUS" are fully equipped.)
https://www.gd.com/news/press-releas...oved-sep-reset
(2006 Last of M1 tanks to be upgraded to SEP expect 2009 final delivery to units for FOC.)
http://id3486.securedata.net/fprado/...ite/abrams.htm
https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com...updated-02834/
(After a 3rd/4th time or more, I've got a little more clarity on the date issue (Above 2 Refs in particular.) and I believe the M1A2 SEP V1 as noted under the M1A2 SEP V2 section. I'm starting to think what really happened here with most not reporting this version while a SMALL handful do is the program (M1A2 SEP V1) started and went straight into the M1A2 SEP V2 program. It is the only thing that makes sense here.)

USA/CHANGE PICTURE/M1A2/UNIT 637/REPLACE WITH UNIT 318 PICTURE//I personally enjoyed that when Don let me get all those USN SKYHAWK pictures replaced mostly in Australia and Israel, F-105 for the Swiss. Also helos for Australia, Switzerland and all the countries that used the French SAR/SPEC OP helo we just updated a year or two ago with the missing MG's. That's almost relaxing compared to the rest!

From Page 85 Posts 852/857 (Only showing the submission from Post 857. This demonstrates HOW FAST things can change based on newer data. 2/24/2020.) Also note I have to use the M1A2 SEP V2 for balance against the next two tanks as well. I don't know what data was used for them, however, we had a lot of data to work from for the M1A2 SEP V2 when it was submitted and except for the date change I submitted for the M1A2 SEP V3 that tank looks good at present.

USMC/CHANGE/M1A1HC FEP VARIENTS/UNITS 467, 468 & 469/START 10/2009 vice 01/2008/TI/GSR 50 vice 45/STABILISER 7 vice 6/UNIT 468 MRAP 7 vice SURVIBILITY 6/SAME MBT AS UNITS 467 & 469// The FEP was a major upgrade to the M1A1 tanks the USMC operated. The contract was awarded on FEB 05, 2005 for the manufacture and installation of the subsystems making up the FEP package. The FOC was reached as submitted above. I cannot find any information to support any other date but, it should be noted however, I found enough to change the date when first submitted in Post 852 after digging deeper (Updated this last sentence for clarification. 2/25/2020), I will gladly in this instance "eat a little crow" concerning that last submission that "I didn't see it before 2010..." at least based on the data I had then.
https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a608067.pdf
(Pg. 6/Para B. Note they used JANE's 2013 ref.))
http://raytheon.mediaroom.com/index.php?item=156
(Para 4)
http://www.defense-aerospace.com/art...-(dec.-6).html
Paras 1 & 6)
https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com...1-tanks-01874/
(Covers both programs as of 2006.)
https://www.heritage.org/military-st...s-marine-corps
https://www.heritage.org/military-strength
(For context only. One of the very few "think tanks" that grade militaries and specifically are the only to do so for ours. The second will get you to the other branches.)
https://www.theengineer.co.uk/issues...ets-new-sight/
(This last ties in the FEP and SEP programs. And as normal USA first.)

From Page 87 Post 862 (My Pic) and Post 868 (Dons edit of my Pic. It’s a beautiful thing!)
USA/CHANGE/M1A2 SEP V2/UNITS 517 & 537/M1A1 AIM/UNIT 636/M1A1 SA/UNIT 886/DELETE CURRENT PICTURES/REPLACE WITH PICTURE AS SUBMITTED BELOW//

REALITY: From changes for the ABRAMS SEP and looking at the refs, I ended Post 858 with:
“A final note did anyone notice a pattern with the Refs? Just from what I posted, it was 12 yrs. for SEP to get into the field. Not bad when you consider ARJUN Mk I took over 30yrs. to get there! These things take time!”

This is why I’m pessimistically, optimistic about equipment dates!!

I don’t think I missed anything for the MBT’S for the 2018 – 2019 Campaign put back here where they should've started from in the first place.

Don and I have already addressed for the 2019 - 2020 Campaign the following MBT issues...
Posts 235 – 238 this Thread, covers South Korean K2 PIP (START Chg.).
T-80ROK UNIT 029 and BMP-3ROK UNIT 061 both retired last year, I believe we settled on END DEC 2019.
.
K2 UNIT 032 got a very INTERESTING ammo change.

Also Ukraine to get an improved T-64 BULAT 17

And finally I also submitted changes to the ARJUN Mk-1A for India (Now there's a surprise!!).

All DONE already by Don these last three and I think most from higher above.

Those will be grouped together and submitted to the MBT Thread at a later date.

Didn't feel like going back to work today, when a 4 day work week was a better option.

I'm done with MBT's! For now.

Time to not waste the rest of this "gift" of being home with you know whom!

Regards,
Pat

[DRG]

Pat.

If you have already posted info and I have marked it with "Thanks" DO NOT post it again please --- that "Thanks" means I have dealt with it in the OOB already I just creates confusion and gives me more aggravation to deal with that I don't want or need. The entire M1A2 SEP issue was dealt with ages ago and the only way I can check this is to go back and compare the last release OOB with the new one and it's a PITA. I have NO IDEA if you have altered any details without going through it all again......at this stage I do not want NOR should I need to go back and do something all again and neither do you.....ONCE is enough and this post is IT for this release

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

Well to be honest I missed your last post. After dinner I decided to use this as I always had in the past prior to 2018/2019 as a check on what I submitted through this thread first. I just completed that check before reading your last post. This was no fun for me either going through as it would turn out, about 35 pages of posts in the MBT Thread to get Parts 1 - 3 finished in here.

So here's the "wash out" from Part 3 "bounced" against the OOB's, again all were spaced apart in the MBT Thread and not as it appears now...
RUSSIA/CHANGE/T-80B/UNIT 061/END/DEC 1992 vice DEC 1985//
First one listed for Russia I believe.

THAILAND/CHANGE/OPLOT-T/UNIT 019/TI/GSR 45 vice 50//
Under UKRAINE entry.
This was an after thought in the last sentence as submitted in Part 3. I now feel it's the right thing to do given the reductions elsewhere to the FCS of that MBT.

USA/DELETE/M1A2C/FORMALLY M1A2 SEP V3/UNIT 537/REDUNDANT TO UNIT 538//
The FCS numbers don't match to UNIT 538. I stopped there.

USA/CHANGE/M1A2 SEP V3-T/UNIT 538/NAME/M1A2C vice M1A2 SEP V3-T/START/JUN 2020 vice OCT 2017/END/DEC 2025 vice DEC 2020//
Everything else appears to be correct.

About my M1A2 FEP entry you can add UNIT 463. None of the FEP tanks should START before 10/2009 with exception of the ones that came in 2016 as I see they got a new main gun. That's why I ended up changing the date twice to get that final one because I had definitive data to support that second change.

I'm leaving it there. Everything else in Part 3 was good. This again in why I culled all this information. As I noted from the start of this, these are my checks and balances. Part 3 took me less than 10 minutes to reverify the data.

Would've posted this much sooner but, the Son and his family stopped by.

Regards,
Pat