Brainstorm: EA/MA/LA Arabian/Islamic themed nation

[Wrana]

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

Wrana:
Ach, more abandoned projects!

You are welcome! Ours was not actually abandoned, I just thought about making some more work on it - I'm just not that good with graphics and am currently under influence of Sloth scale...

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

I used to be passable at pixel art. Its been years since i've done any. Mostly I found its something that just requires a lot of patience and a willingness to tinker. Which means if I can crib from other people's work, it certainly wouldn't hurt, but I think I'm capable of eventually producing something that I could live with.

That's good! I've also seen currently another thread with similar intent - and it looks another guy who can draw appeared. Maybe now we will end up with something playable!

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

Regarding ages:
Obviously I agree that a jann-dominated EA is a good idea. However, this actually gives me four ages worth of material, which is where i start dithering over where the division between MA/LA is in the OP.

EA: Jann Kings
MA: Jihad - spreading of Islam and the early caliphate. (Think 700-1000AD) Probably work a city of wonders themed baghdad in here.
LA1: Crusades era. Well developed military, powerful cavalry, etc...
LA2: Early Ottoman Empire. This has the signature disadvantage of require firearms *and* cannon. (Talking about the turks without talking about cannon is stupid. They emerge into history with the defeat of Byzantium - a siege famous for the use of rather large cannon). I'm not sure I want to deal with making bullet/cannonball graphics either, although it would be a rather different nation...

Maybe this is worth 2 separate LA nations, and give the Turks their due as a separate power? (Makes historical sense as well).

Hm. I thought about it. A disadvantage of Jihad period is that it is both contrary to many things which are "common knowledge" about Arabic warfare and realtively unknown: later period has much more sources on it. Plus, this looks somewhat outside Dominions tradition - on the other hand, various existing texts often use notes about various great predescessors in past (see LA Arcoscephales). So I decided to place Mohammad between EA and MA in the end.
As for Turks - the thing is, they replaced arabic states, they didn't coexist with them. And taking Constantinopolis was not when even Osmans emerged - they already had powerful political presence before this (Bizantium remains paid them for a long time and some of these states were officially vassals of Sultans) and it's possible their attack on Byzantium capital could occurr much earlier if not for Tamerlan. Cannons were prominent in historical Porta, but it's possible to replace them in fantasy world. I just replaced janissary handgunners with crossbowmen and left heavy artillery for battle mages...

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

And of course, Persia has enough material to deserve its own mod nation and not intrude here!

Yes, but there are many common mitfs in folklore here. Actually, what we know as "Arabian nights" is late version, heavily influenced by Persians. I have some extracts from earlier Arabian texts, but they are few and I have an impression that this is also the case generally. On the other hand, there are much more Persian and Persianised sources...

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

The funny thing about fantasy in general is that it has this weird ahistorical idea that truly heavy armor and crossbows predate the use of cannons. As our earliest evidence for cannon use goes back to the 13th century, this is patently false, and firearms followed not long afterwards. They wouldn't become dominant considerations on the battlefield for a century or two, but they were certainly present. I would expect the LA to have cannons and a firearm unit for many of the more military-focused nations.

Surely! On the other hand, an appearance of gunpowder artillery in Europe was precipitated by the loss of art of making torsion-driven machines during Dark Ages. This technology was rebuilt during Rennaissance, but by the time cannons had also appeared. And handguns could not appear without some trafition of cannon-making... I actually think that there was a possibility that firearms would not develop, and crossbows and torsion machines being later replaced with gauss guns and similar... More to our subject, in fantasy world there could be a possibility that gunpoweder artillery won't emerge due to lack of necessity in it, long range attacks and wall reducing being performed by mages/monsters. Also, siege engines in Dominions are abstracted in Siege bonus, so you can just mention it in description... In other words - where we have Spanish and German pikemen without supporting artillery, we can have Sipahi and Janissaries without them, too!

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

Genius Locus:
The idea is pre-islam, and pan-mesopotamian. Actually the idea of jinni is too. The term Genius Locus is latin, as the idea was transmitted to Rome following its conquest of the holy land area. A genius in latin is a type of spirit entity, so genius locus is literally a 'location spirit' (with the appropriate connotations on spirit from genius). The latin word genius is actually the immediate root for the english 'genie'. (Latin genius may be derived from jinni, although its hard to know for certain).

Interesting, thank you. Words are quite similar, but... Romans were also quite ready to make something abstract into a deity, so it's possible that they were the source. Or it developed independent. Or it's a proof they really came from Troy...