First Post: Suggestions on Nation choices?

[Networkingguru]

llamabeast said:
It was an inside joke, just because a week or so back we had two or three threads talking about the monkey PD being bad in excruciating detail. Well, one guy was quite upset about it being so weak and talked about it at great length and the rest of us were just a bit bewildered.

Signing up to MP games is not very hard in fact. The difficulty is just in finding one. The trick is just to look at the MP forum every day or two, and see if any games are advertising players. If they are' just post to say you'd like to play and you'll be started in no time. Games start up pretty frequently, and both me and lch host games for new players quite often (although you will be welcome to join any game).

The IRC channel is largely for blitzes, i.e. "I have several hours free and want to play NOW". Personally I never go on there - I just don't tend to have time.

Games organised here tend to have one turn a day and last for several months. Although it sounds slow, trust me, it gets exciting. In many ways it adds to the experience as you have time to really think about your strategies.

Wow. One turn a day does sound incredibly slow. That's basically PBEM speed. However, I enjoy very large maps, so a few hours isn't going to cut it either. Are there "middle-ground" games? If not, what does it take to host a game?

[quantum_mechani]

'A few hours' is a very loose description of blitz games. They almost always last at least 2-3 hours, and I've played them as long as 8. That said, you will probably have difficulty finding players that want to blitz on very large maps, since 25+ provinces per player past turn 40 can already be nearing an hour per turn.

[Sombre]

I don't think the IRC channel is mainly for blitzes - a lot of mod discussion, balance discussion and whatnot goes on there. There are blitzes set up too, but that isn't the main thing we talk about.

[vfb]

Networkingguru said:
LOL, will do.

As far as man, I just started a game with them based on the previous suggestions, and I have to admit, I am enjoying it so far. However, I am intrigued that you do not use PD. I can't see how you get away with no PD unless you keep an army in every province, which doesn't really seem economically feasible. With all the random events, not to mention spells that can target from afar and flying units, I don't see how you can secure provinces without using PD. Can you elaborate?

Oops, sorry to give the impression that you should have zero PD. I'll always buy 1PD -- this lets me see what I get invaded by. I'll buy 3PD if I can afford it (ha ha, no seriously, sometimes you're 2GP away from another elephant or knight or mage, and in that case I will get just 1PD). 1-3PD will stop enemy scouts from taking your provinces.

I'll put 5-10PD in any province that I think might get call-of-winded.

As someone else remarked, in MP, PD is not a deterrent to stop other players from attacking you. The deterrent is your capability to counter-attack.

When you lose a province to a remote attack or random event, if the province is now independent, you can take your time and send an army group to retake it. Or, a couple of assassins with skulls (sorry, none for Man!) can liberate provinces from Knights or Barbarians on their own.

If another player has done something like teleport or fly or sneak a stealth army into a province you own, then you can use your own rituals to kill their commanders. With Man, you get A3 crones, so you could rain down some seeking arrows. They'll have a PD commander so they won't auto-route, but if you can keep the army immobilized (no commanders) and bring up a bigger army to route it, your enemy will lose all the units.

Try not to leave temples outside forts, since it'll cost you 200 gold if your enemy razes it (400 for most other nations). Try not to leave labs outside forts, because they can be used against you.

[Networkingguru]

vfb said:

Oops, sorry to give the impression that you should have zero PD. I'll always buy 1PD -- this lets me see what I get invaded by. I'll buy 3PD if I can afford it (ha ha, no seriously, sometimes you're 2GP away from another elephant or knight or mage, and in that case I will get just 1PD). 1-3PD will stop enemy scouts from taking your provinces.

I'll put 5-10PD in any province that I think might get call-of-winded.

As someone else remarked, in MP, PD is not a deterrent to stop other players from attacking you. The deterrent is your capability to counter-attack.

When you lose a province to a remote attack or random event, if the province is now independent, you can take your time and send an army group to retake it. Or, a couple of assassins with skulls (sorry, none for Man!) can liberate provinces from Knights or Barbarians on their own.

If another player has done something like teleport or fly or sneak a stealth army into a province you own, then you can use your own rituals to kill their commanders. With Man, you get A3 crones, so you could rain down some seeking arrows. They'll have a PD commander so they won't auto-route, but if you can keep the army immobilized (no commanders) and bring up a bigger army to route it, your enemy will lose all the units.

Try not to leave temples outside forts, since it'll cost you 200 gold if your enemy razes it (400 for most other nations). Try not to leave labs outside forts, because they can be used against you.

OK, I understand. Seems like MP is considerably different from SP in this regard. In SP, I have the habit of posting 20 in PD in every province I take, the moment I take it, in the early game. By late game, that number has risen to 50 - 100, depending on how much I expect to be attacked there. If nothing else, it seems like a good investment, just to damage the enemy a little with zero upkeep cost. On the other hand, 50 PD costs like 1000 gold, so if you can buy a decent army for less than that, I guess it's not a very intellegent investment.

[Networkingguru]

quantum_mechani said:
'A few hours' is a very loose description of blitz games. They almost always last at least 2-3 hours, and I've played them as long as 8. That said, you will probably have difficulty finding players that want to blitz on very large maps, since 25+ provinces per player past turn 40 can already be nearing an hour per turn.

OUCH! Having never played this MP, I am having a hard time seeing how it takes that long. In the late game, I may take 15 minutes to complete a turn (except for LA Ermor, LOL), but definitely no longer. How does MP work? Does each player take thier turn and then the next player gets to try? I was under the impression that turn decisions were simultanious?

[quantum_mechani]

It's simultaneous, but as I said, it can easily take individual players close to an hour for a turn (though it depends on a lot of factors, especially if you are in an intense war, careful scripting eats a lot of time).

[KissBlade]

Amusingly enough you seem to be very very fond of the powerhouse nations. You might consider Pythium next. They seem to suit your tastes for MA. If you want to try something that requires a bit more finesse yet retain the SC/thug feel, Yomi is a nice pick. LA TC is quite good actually. A variety of magics as well as a good amount of strats you can do.

[Twan]

If you want to try a water nation like the ones you like, Atlantis is a good choice in all ages too (in Early of course, it's one of the best thug nation, with lot of high hp/good prot leaders, but in MA or even in LA the big mages/good hp leaders can become above average thugs, and in all eras summoned Sea Kings are also a good base).

ps : but note that sea nations aren't at all a challenge against most AIs, land computer nations are very unefficient at invading seas, you'll just have to worry about other sea powers

[llamabeast]

Re one turn/day being slow: For the first 20 or so turns it is definitely a bit slow, but after that tends to feel about right to me. People often play two or even three games at once, but it's important to stagger them, otherwise they all reach late game at once and your head explodes.