Wondering if people would be interested...

Scott Hebert · #1 February 5th, 2004, 07:27 PM

Hi, I'm new here and to Dominions 2, but I think it's a great game and was thinking of doing something for it.

Specifically, I was thinking of making a spreadsheet or database that would calculate the most efficient use of points at the start of the game to produce an effect of X. For example, which Pretender God should I pick if I want a Dominion of at least 5, a Fire skill of 4, and a Nature skill of 6? Using the spreadsheet files Online, this shouldn't be too hard to calculate (in terms of points; unfortunately, other concerns (like Pretender God attack capabilities) would be harder to quantify).

If anyone is interested, I'll really work on it, instead of working on it whenever I want to, as a personal project.

Bayushi Tasogare

Targa · #2 February 5th, 2004, 07:55 PM

Sounds great! The thing that I find myself twiddling with the most are my choices to try to have as few points left over as possible. If you can make it do "spend points efficiently and have as near zero design points left over as possible" that would rock!

Off the top of my head, I'd say it'd need some kind of prioritizing system so you can select specifics (ex: I want this castle no matter what, has to have +4 fire magic, don't care too much about starting dominion, etc... ) I have no clue as to what you could do or not, so these are just suggestions.

I think it's great that you're willing to give your time to the community. Finding a niche and filling it is a great way to contribute to a game you enjoy. We all owe a debt of gratitude to the people that freely contribute their time, effort, knowledge, and resources to make this community what it is.

condors · #3 February 5th, 2004, 08:03 PM

sounds great

Gandalf Parker · #4 February 5th, 2004, 08:22 PM

Sounds good. At least I would get to see a spreadsheet that is ACTUALLY a spreadtsheet (excel must be the most abused program of all times)

It wont be a simple project though. You might start by screen capturing all the god choices and the text descripts of them. Seems to me that the initial cost of each, plus the different costs they have for adding magic, or adding dominion, will have to be included. And I guess if they are all there then you will need to include who does or doesnt get them.

What might be easier if you wanted to do it would be to do a generic one. It would only be useful for people doing things like manuall created gods to be assigned as part of a map, but it would be much easier since for that it can be any unit in the game (even things like Doom Horrors) and there are no costs. I have trouble doing the math so that my creations are at least CLOSE to what the game allows players to create. Hmmm in fact, if you could get it to write out or print a text screen of the commands to cut-n-paste that god into a map it would be great. Oh sorry. My brain kicks in and runs amuck. Anyway, your initial idea sounds great.

Scott Hebert · #5 February 5th, 2004, 09:05 PM

Well, I plan to use the information provided in the Excel spreadsheets that are Online (where, I forget). If they are not accurate, please LMK.

Regarding costs, AFAICT they are equal for all Pretenders. To increase your Dominion N times costs 7*(sigma N). That is, 7 for the first point, 14 for the second (for a total of 21), 21 for the 3rd point (for a total of 42), etc.

Magic increases work the same, except the base number is 8.

Scales and Castles are pretty much known.

This will more likely work with Access than Excel. I can run a simple query to select the parts I want (Fire 5, Earth 5, Dominion 5), and then it will tell you which Pretender gets that combination for the fewest points, and how many those are.

Right now it is supposed to be a utility to help you build a Pretender God for the right combination of things you want.

If there is anything incorrect in this post, please LMK and I'll get to work revising it.

Bayushi Tasogare

PhilD · #6 February 5th, 2004, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bayushi Tasogare:
Hi, I'm new here and to Dominions 2, but I think it's a great game and was thinking of doing something for it.

Bayushi Tasogare

I don't have much to comment on your spreadsheet idea (go for it! great idea! it's just too much work for me to take part in it!), but your nickname lets me believe we actually have two hobbies in common.

And no, I'm not volunteering to create the "Emerald Empire" mod. Maybe try it out when you're finished doing it

Scott Hebert · #7 February 5th, 2004, 09:39 PM

Shosuro Phil, then, I take it?

As for the Rokugan mod, I've already thought about it. Come on, it's not even that hard, and the current tensions in the Shadowlands between Iuchiban (Blood Magic) and Daigotsu (Death Magic) can even be highlighted.

One thing at a time.

Bayushi Tasogare

Gandalf Parker · #8 February 5th, 2004, 09:46 PM

Maybe Im not understanding then. Doesnt the fact that my pretender of choice already have a 3 in dominion and 2 in nature magic affect the costs?

aldin · #9 February 5th, 2004, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Maybe Im not understanding then. Doesnt the fact that my pretender of choice already have a 3 in dominion and 2 in nature magic affect the costs?

I believe that's where it buys from. In your example it would cost 7 points for dominion 4 and 8 for nature 3, whereas a natural dominion 2, nature 1 would pay 7 for dominion 3 and 8 for nature 2.

~Aldin

Scott Hebert · #10 February 5th, 2004, 10:05 PM

Aldin is correct. Let's say you have an Oracle (base Dominion 4) and an Archmage (base Dominion 1, 30 points). For the Oracle to have a Dominion of 6 costs 21 points. For the Archmage to have the same costs 105 points, plus his original cost of 30 points, for a grand total of 135 points. Thus, if all you want is a Dominion of 6, it is wiser to take an Oracle than an Archmage.

That's what the database will be designed to do. The above example is rather intuitive, but I hope to make it so that other much harder questions can be solved just as easily. The example is not meant to lecture or teach anyone the cost difference cited.

The cost to _increase_ Dominion or Magic skills use the same formula, however. At least, my research has led to that conclusion. Also, to get level 1 in a new magic path requires the number points mentioned under each Pretender God, and it _also_ counts as the first 'increase'. Therefore, the second point costs 16.

Hope this helps. When my fiancee is through playing Heroes IV, I'll probably start to work on this.

Bayushi Tasogare