Enterprise + Borg

[Fyron]

Enterprise is meeting the Borg... wtf? Can they not at least try to be original, and try not to destroy the Last vestiges of continuity left in Star Trek?

[Katchoo]

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Enterprise is meeting the Borg... wtf? Can they not at least try to be original, and try not to destroy the Last vestiges of continuity left in Star Trek?

Of course not! This whole "Temporal Cold War" idea is going to mess up the Star Trek Universe rather badly. And considering Voyager finshed it's series with the ship fully powered with technology from the future, any future spinoffs will have to answer the effects of that.

Of course, they could screw over the continuity for the next few years and then finish Enterprise with some "event" that wipes out all knowledge that the "Temporal Cold War" ever happened. Kind of like how the Newhart Show ended with the whole series being a dream of Bob Newhart

What I don't understand is why they don't use the Gorn at all? They've got this perfectly good race that has been as under-developed as you can under-develop something, and it's a race that fans of the franchise want to see.

Or better yet, cancel Star Trek and get Babylon 5 or a spinoff of B5 back in production.

[Captain Kwok]

Ok, well this was a rerun episode anyway so most of the relevant criticisms have already been established.

One could argue this was a good continuity of the story from Star Trek: First Contact. But, it's too bad that the show can keep focus on the Andorian-Vulcan pre-Federation and exploration themes that are much stronger/better than most of these meet the 24th Century Aliens but then forget all about them episodes. Oh well, what can you do?

I never cared about Trek that much anyways, I just like the ships.

[Captain Kwok]

Katchoo:

Technically they can't use the Gorn because supposedly Kirk was the guy who made first contact in whatever TOS episode, but for me, I'm all for met the Gorn!!!

[Fyron]

Or better yet, cancel Star Trek and get Babylon 5 or a spinoff of B5 back in production.

I second that motion!

[Atrocities]

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Enterprise is meeting the Borg... wtf? Can they not at least try to be original, and try not to destroy the Last vestiges of continuity left in Star Trek?

You have to keep in mind that in the end, that is the end of the series, Archer and gang will not have exsited. You see, instead of going on the mission to take the Klingon home, Star Fleet listens to the Vulcans and keeps Archer at home. The Klingon dies, and the Temperal Cold war goes on without Earth ever having become involved in it prior to 27th century. The first ships meet up with the Romulans and war breaks out. No Archer missions, no discoveries, no borg prior to the original encounter thus the original time line is preserved. From what I have read, Archer is going to be given the choice to go back in time and stop himself from forcing the issues or watch as Earth is destroyed. He sabotages the warp drive of the NX - Enterprise which results in its destruction in space dock. The Klingons blame Earth for the death of their operative, and the Klingon Earth cold war begins.

Arch goes on to become a diplomat to Andor and is fundamental in bringing the Vulcans and Andorans into an alliance that becomes the Federation.

Basically Archers voyages never happened. Or that was the way it was pitched to Paramount, but as it has become known as, the R&B Ripple effect. A sarcastic statement that has come to characterize Rick Berman and Brandon Braga constant desire to change things and blow continuity all to hell. One can say that there are billions of Star Trek universe and that the stories these people tell are fragments from one quantum universe or another, so continuity does not matter. (And they call themselves writers!)

Enterprise, or as it is now know, Nosurpise, is a good show, that has a seven year mission to bore us death and completely and utterly alter the established, or previously established, continuity of the trek universe.

I will say the the episodes that have used races such as the Romulans, Borg, and tholions have been well done and enjoyable.

"How dull do you have to be to have to "steal" story concepts and characters from other shows? Lame as hell would be the answer. No talent, shallow imaginations, lacking commitment, and above all else, driven by Ratings." - From a trek forum

I do not buy this, and hope that other do not as well. Put yourself in the writers shoes and walk a mile with them working under the Dictators and you will do what they demand or find yourself out of work like a lot of other former star trek writers. Just ask Ira Stevens about that.

[ August 21, 2003, 09:03: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

[JurijD]

WHY I WILL ALWAYS LIKE STAR TREK:

Well... I really don�t give a damn if the Enterprise voyages never end up actually happening because of some spinn off of the grandfather paradox...

And I also don�t care if people think that episodes don�t connect as well as they THINK they should.

I�ve been watching Star Trek since I was about 4 or 5 I think... so I have a special view on the matter and different expectations than most of the sci-fi gurus that jump from B5 , SG1, Andromeda and all the other mumbo jumbo to ST and complain that it doesn�t meet their demands.

In my view Star Trek has always been and always will be a fascinating show to watch as it inevitably forces you to question your own beliefes and convictions. In a way the episodes (from TOS to TNG especially, DS9 and VOY and now ENTERPRISE) are written in the tradition of greek tragedies... you are confronted with a moral dillema that appears to be unsolvable and as you watch you get the thrill of seeing how it is resolved. Now because of this episodes may be disconnected, story lines may be corny, there is one too many transporter accidents but I gladly overlook all this for the thrill of watching a good Star Trek episode that basically says that:

if we work hard, don�t give up and do our best our future will be something we will be proud off.

And in my mind Star Trek is among the very few sci-fi episodes that doesn�t paint a dark and evil future where machines take over, people are killed by endless wars and we end up destroying our little blue rock...

No, Star Trek tells of a future where on Earth they mug people as a tourist attraction, hunger and war are in a long passed chapter of history and in the ST future we finally realized that it doesn�t matter if your skin is black, brown, white or green... or if you have 3 , 4 or no bumps on your head what does matter is that we find strenght in our differences and work for a better tomorrow.

and thats why I like Star Trek.... so you see that it really doesn�t bother me if episodes don�t match or someone thinks the writers are used up...

Jurij Dreo, a true fan of Star Trek

[General Woundwort]

I hate to say it, Atrocities, but the ST franchise has been going downhill for awhile now. It's a natural outworking of the "We gotta top the Last series" syndrome, and it leads to things like this (totally screwing with the timeline so that entire series 'never happened' in-canon, whatever that means.)

(EDIT - a good turn of phrase I have heard about this syndrome is "jumping the shark". Apparently in one of the Last episodes of Happy Days they had Fonzie jump his motorcycle over a pool full of sharks. They had fallen badly into the "gotta top the prior episode" syndrome, and it marked the beginning of the end of the series.)

IMHO, they ought to quitely retire ST for a period of time, rest their creative juices, and come back to it when nobody cares about "having to top the Last series".

ATTN: Paramount - Stick a fork in it, it's done...

(EDIT again - here's a Jump the Shark Website's take on Enterprise...

Link Here )

[ August 21, 2003, 11:52: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Atrocities:
From what I have read, Archer is going to be given the choice to go back in time and stop himself from forcing the issues or watch as Earth is destroyed. He sabotages the warp drive of the NX - Enterprise which results in its destruction in space dock. The Klingons blame Earth for the death of their operative, and the Klingon Earth cold war begins.

Theorizing that one could time travel within his own lifetime, Dr. Sam Beckett led an elite group of scientists into the desert to develop a top secret project, known as Quantum Leap. Pressured to prove his theories or lose funding, Dr. Beckett prematurely stepped into the Project's Accelerator and vanished.

He awoke to find himself in the past, suffering from partial amnesia, and facing a mirror image that was not his own. Fortunately, contact with his own time was maintained through brainwave transmissions with Al, the Project Observer, who appeared in the form of a hologram that only Dr. Beckett can see and hear.

Trapped in the past, Dr. Beckett finds himself leaping from life to life putting things right that once went wrong and hoping each time that his next leap will be the leap home.

Scene 1:

The familer bright blue electrical discharge fades away and we see Sam standing in the middle of a strange room facing a large viewscreen on the front wall. On the screen is the image of a creatue that can only be described as doglike. Despite the canine resemblance the creature appears to be standing upright and Sam get's the distinct impression that this being is intelligent. The creature stares menacingly at Sam as if waiting for a reply to a question that was uttered before Sam leaped in to this body.

Yoshi: "Captain, the Gol'thar have given us an ultimatum. The translation appears to be, "Stand to and prepare to be boarded, or you will be destroyed."

Sam: "Oh boy."

Fade to black

End Scene 1

[ August 21, 2003, 13:30: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

[narf poit chez BOOM]

i have to agree. NG came a while after TOS and was good. then there was DS9 soon after, and it was not so good with the 'who do we fight now so we can have something interesting on a space station'. but once they got that straigtened out, it was mostly good. then there was V while DS9 was still running, and suprisingly, it was mostly good. and then there was enterprise. and i stopped watching. so they should have waited a while.

things that shouldn't have been in ST:
Q
Borg
hey, let's make the klingons ugly becuase their society is evil.
hey, let's turn a psychologist into a sex object.
hey, let's turn a hardened resistance fighter into a sex object.
hey, let's turn a borg into a sex object.
destroying the borg with only one ship.

[ August 21, 2003, 16:01: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]