Guide: MA Mictlan - An Introduction

[Agema]

Don't underestimate the X1 priests. Sky Priests are possibly the worst, as A1 is in my view next to useless, although they do have that rather handy +10 patrol if someone tries sneaking, so maybe keep a few around.

Of the normal Mictlan Priests (100% F/N/S/W), S1 are cheap communion slaves - excellent. W1 are pretty weak early on, however I think cleansing water gives them useful anti-undead powers where bless might not bother a high MR target. Later on, they can spam Frozen Heart. F1 can fire unspectacular but still useful artillery from early on. N1 are maybe harder to leverage usefully. Tangle vines? Surprisingly useful in large numbers.

At Magic-0, although your recruitment costs for priests and Nahualli are very comparable per research point (Priest: 20gold, Nahualli: 22), your upkeep is twice as much (Priest: 0.67/turn, Nahualli 1.40/turn). Increased research makes priests even more efficient (at magic-1, 15/0.50 compared to 18/1.17). The savings on cost and upkeep can rapidly translate into more castles quickly, then you could transfer to more Nahuallis as you look at combat mages and for the rare B/D picks.

[AreaOfEffect]

Communions is one way to boost the effectiveness of the Nahualli. Another is to cast Light of the Northern Star. I find that being boosted to astral 2 opens up many doors that are all very low on the research tree. Paralyze, Mind Blast, and Stellar Cascades are you mainstays. Combine Light of the Northern Star with a reverse communion boosted with Power of the Spheres and you can have over a dozen flying S3N3 mages who can all survive at least one stray missile by changing forms.

Still, I can't argue with brute efficiency. The Mictlan Priest is indeed a more then worthy commander. I would never underestimate this strategy simply because I myself wouldn't use it. There is also room for something in between. After you've built your second castle, switching to Nahualli to shore up your battle magic while using the priests to power the research would likely be a the better of both worlds.

Edit: Agema, there are plenty of uses for the A1 mages when given the right research. They can be used to protect you back lines using a combination of Aim and Orb Lightning. Phantasmal Warrior can also be surprisingly effective when spammed. Going back to Aim, they make decent candidates for some of the magic ranged weapons, especially with a water bless. Finally, when you cast storm you can easily upgrade them all to A2 mages, which screams lightning bolts. Note that storms can be really helpful in protecting you jaguar warriors and moon warriors from arrow fire.

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect

Still, I like your shrewd approach. Granted, having scales on might make you a target, but it might also make you one of those, "I'll deal with them later" factions who creep along the game being unchecked because they have a good bless, powerful research, and perhaps some good diplomacy.

You mean one of those "oh god please sing a NAP with me so I have half a chance in this game" nations?


I'm curious about this Mictlan-Priest-centric strategy, as I am quite fond of M3 on a nation that has incredibly low cost research mages. Also, I can see good uses for all variants of the Priest, as the game progresses (though the N variant's best use is as your research baseline while the rest get more busy).

I may try them again in SP just to see..... I'd personally use a bit different bless though, I'm not sure. That's one of my biggest problems with Mictlan, I can't find a bless that I really feel is a game winner, and for the cost, F9/W9 just doesn't give me that vibe (playstyle playstyle playstyle ).


Oh, and I seem to remember a certain person making ample use of Sky Priests..... Arrow Fend handily stopped 20 Nether Darts spamming Starspawns from annihilating an army.

[AreaOfEffect]

Originally Posted by JimMorrison

Oh, and I seem to remember a certain person making ample use of Sky Priests..... Arrow Fend handily stopped 20 Nether Darts spamming Starspawns from annihilating an army.

Yeah, arrow fend can do that.

Combine with antimagic for maximum effect.

[vfb]

Originally Posted by JimMorrison

You mean one of those "oh god please sing a NAP with me so I have half a chance in this game" nations?


I'm curious about this Mictlan-Priest-centric strategy, as I am quite fond of M3 on a nation that has incredibly low cost research mages. Also, I can see good uses for all variants of the Priest, as the game progresses (though the N variant's best use is as your research baseline while the rest get more busy).

I may try them again in SP just to see..... I'd personally use a bit different bless though, I'm not sure. That's one of my biggest problems with Mictlan, I can't find a bless that I really feel is a game winner, and for the cost, F9/W9 just doesn't give me that vibe (playstyle playstyle playstyle ).


Oh, and I seem to remember a certain person making ample use of Sky Priests..... Arrow Fend handily stopped 20 Nether Darts spamming Starspawns from annihilating an army.

That would be a High Priest of the Sky casting Arrow Fend, not a Sky Priest. Sky Priests in CBM 1.3 can spam confusion, but 1.4 bumps Confusion to A2. A few Sky Priests can also cast Aim for your other mages, and maybe Orb Lightning. If you are bringing a staff of storms to help you cast Fog Warriors then the A1s can all Summon Storm Power.

I prefer a F9S9 bless as Area of Effect suggests, and you can easily get that with an imprisoned Oracle without having horrible scales. I tried Dom10, Order3, Sloth3, Heat3, Growth1, Misf2, Magic1 and it worked quite nicely. Dom10 lets you hire more sacreds. I wouldn't take Death scales with MA Mictlan because I really like the High Priests of the Sky.

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by vfb

That would be a High Priest of the Sky casting Arrow Fend, not a Sky Priest. Sky Priests in CBM 1.3 can spam confusion, but 1.4 bumps Confusion to A2. A few Sky Priests can also cast Aim for your other mages, and maybe Orb Lightning. If you are bringing a staff of storms to help you cast Fog Warriors then the A1s can all Summon Storm Power.

I did not mean to cause any confusion by being lazy with the name.

[chrispedersen]

Originally Posted by chrispedersen

Thanks!

Yeah, I actually *really* liked your comment about the nahuli flying turkey. And some of those tactics you mentioned are ones I really should incorporate in my game play.

The problem I have with a nahuli is that I never really know what to do with a S/N mage in middle age. To me, they always scream: Horror mark/ curse.. which is a tactic better suited early and late. Now they are still fodder for communions - but so are what quarter/half? (B/S randoms?) of mictlan priests. And jags don't *need* mage support to slaughter elephants.

14 jags and two priests 470 gp - will easily handle 4 elephants and random commander.

Mictlan priests - early middle AND late are my top 3 favorite units in the game.

Great Blood hunter - or great magic diversity.
Great Researcher
GREAT Bless Platform
Great Lab builder (ME)/Great Temple Builder
Great Communion Fodder

And on top of that - they can blood hunt, and blood sacrifice as well (EA, LA).

And they have one other feature I really, really like: Low opportunity cost. With a pretender or high cost mage unit - you're always debating alternatives. The cost of a mictlan priest is so small, you can afford him to enter that tiny strange hut - you can afford him to site search - sure theres not much chance - but there's also not much risk - and if it can save you from having a higher cost mage do it - its probably worth it.

Continueing strategy:

If you are playing CBM, depending on version owl quills might be Con-2. Either way, consider Evocation-2 as your next research goal. Fully 1/4 of your mictlan priests will be able to cast arcane probing.

Research Goals: Con-6 for skullcaps, and water boosters.which will let your couatls gate troops around. And if you don't want to wait for your pretender to wake con-6 will get you water boosters to summon tlaloques.

Thau 2, for site searching. Thau -5 for gateway.

Other than that: Conjuration.


Side note: in cbm you can take the lawgiver, and get a triple bless (air, astral water). This is an interesting route to go MP. It works fairly well and will not be expected.

Basic idea: Post up well back. Use your sacreds (with twist, high defense, and easy to mass) as a screen.

First, for archery (windguide .. enchanted arrows...arrowfend).
Later, as they are 75% shock resistant for shockwave/lightning spam.


Now one other interesting hting you can do... Ya get a reasonable number of these eagle warriors.. ya guard a skypriest or 4.

SkyPriest 1 hold hold hold Divine Blessing whatever
Skypriest 2-x hold hold hold attack Rear shockwave.

Interesting fact or 3: the commanders seem to do a better job than regular troops attacking rear. The eagles can't fly till the divine bless goes off, so you're not burning fatige flying and guarding.

And of course if you'd rather cast lightning bolts or buffs rather than holding - well I guess we'll let ya.

And you can do a 9S9A4W bless and only sleep. Which means a rapid return to blood, via tlaloques.

Sorta like a warm weather caelum.

Now, I don't like it as much as regular jag warriors. Eagles die in droves. And you have to completely change how you think ... instead of avoiding archers (like regular F/w jags - plow right in). On the other hand - you can't go toe to toe (with anything) its your sky priests that are provinding the firepower.

Liberal use of mictlans very cheap 7/2 slinger recommended. So they can't hit the broad side of a barn... they can't hit you either.

[P3D]

CBM 1.5 (as it is) made the Lawgiver a no-brainer (starting dom 3, S2 instead of S1).

I'd argue for a minor B4 bless instead of W4. You already have two damage avoidance blesses with A9S9, and B4 makes your eagle warriors deal 15+14 damage per turn.

[chrispedersen]

Finally, I never mentioned why I like the D3 with turmoil and neutral to positive luck:

It potentially solves two of your magic holes.

Necromancers (d2) will come and bring you troops. And finally troll kings will come and kick your butt... Either enslave a troll king (difficult to do) or enslave a troll (easy to do)
and GOR him.

Niche... but...

Tada! E3.

[TwoBits]

The Lawgiver is certainly an improvement, but I still don't see how his base qualities, aside from Astral, are all that helpful. MA Mictlan's mainstay, the Eagle Warrior, has too few HP to benefit from an N bless, and because of it's tactical flying, doesn't need an A blessing to avoid missile-fire. And I'd think you'd still need either F9 or D9 for an offensive punch, and that starts to get expensive on the Lawgiver platform.

Speaking of offensive punch, which do folks prefer for MA Mictlan, fire or death? I think there was a thread a while back discussing the relative merits of both, but what are people's thoughts on that regarding Mictlan specifically?

IMO, with death over fire, you give up a good amount of early game firepower, but death seems like it will still be relevant later on, when fire begins to be neutralized by high level magic and/or forged items. Plus with all your sacred mage-priests, you'll be causing a lot more afflictions.

Does anyone know if the death blessing affliction chance works with the Jaguar Toad's poison spit, or the Monster Toad's poison aura? And did anyone satisfactorily determine if it works with Seeking Arrow (there were tests, but I don't know if any were done against large HP targets)?