Proportions Mod Versions 2.5.2 and 2.5.3 available

[oleg]

Originally posted by Aloofi:
I definitively want an improved fighter combat model with Proportions.[/QB]

Hmmm, I actually like current Proportions' fighters. Very balanced weapon selection IMHO. "combat-only" fighters would be a nice addition but overall it looks about right for me.

[JLS]

Ok, im cooled down!

My intent with the AIC Mods was not to improve Proportions;

But was to show that the AI can compete, with a Human Players with the Modifications I released with AIC and only with Proportions as the Host!
~~~~
This thing is of me (�REWORKING his fighter idea�???) did get me inflamed.

[JLS]

Originally posted by oleg:

quote:

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Originally posted by Aloofi:
I definitively want an improved fighter combat model with Proportions.

Hmmm, I actually like current Proportions' fighters. Very balanced weapon selection IMHO. "combat-only" fighters would be a nice addition but overall it looks about right for me.[/QB]

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I agree, Oleg...

There is nothing wrong with current Proportion fighters; they are pretty much the same as, the base se4 fighters.
~
But the premise, is that the AI can not defend properly against a Long Range Carrier attack on his home world!

This was my reason for the Tactical Fighter Mod �
Fighters now move in Tactical combat only. On the Strategic map, when launched over a planet or any sector, they remain on combat patrol for that sector until recovered by a Carrier or your planet.

"(When you attack a planet, you will now need to commit your fleet and Carriers where the AI will be able to defend itself ) ouch!"

I also tried to address some stacking issues with fighters versus Ships.
And I have been getting a lot of positive response for this effort.

[ March 13, 2003, 21:17: Message edited by: JLS ]

[PsychoTechFreak]

Originally posted by JLS:

Ok, im cooled down!

My intent with the AIC Mods was not to improve Proportions;

But was to show that the AI can compete, with a Human Players with the Modifications I released with AIC and only with Proportions as the Host!

AI can compete with your modifications as well as with AI bonus turned on in a non-AIcampaign game. You provide the AI cheaper components/facilities and a helping AI research tree. Well, I know it is a lot of work to balance everything out and I certainly do not have the modding experience to see everything about it, but this is easy to see (e.g. AI Wormhole opener components just cost 1000 minerals etc.).

Don't get me wrong, I like your ideas and it is certainly better in order to finetune the given AI bonus instead of just putting the bonus level to low/med/high.
I just don't like the statement "competing AI" if the reality behind it is a bonus in fact.

[JLS]

[quote]Originally posted by PsychoTechFreak:

Don't get me wrong, I like your ideas and it is certainly better in order to finetune the given AI bonus instead of just putting the bonus level to low/med/high.
I just don't like the statement "competing AI" if the reality behind it is a bonus in fact.

Good Point, PsychoTechFreak.

I should have stated, with a leveler Playing field

[ March 13, 2003, 23:31: Message edited by: JLS ]

[Fyron]

In short, I said that for the next major Version, I would probably re-work fighters, and make the first ones start out without terribly high combat modifiers or abilities, and unable to move out of the sector they launch in.

This will not work properly. Fighters have a 1 strategic move minimum, even with no engines.

JLS:

As you can see; PvK, POSTED and implied that I STOLE his fighter Idea.
This is not true!

PvK has put a flame to our bridge, not I.

That is not what I see having happened. It looks to me like you seem to think that noone has ever thought of ideas you have thought of before. This is quite wrong. I know that I for one had thought of orbital fighters and such back in 2001, long before you ever started on AIC. This is not to say that I was the first person to think of this. Actually, I never made any Posts about it at the time, so I could not have been the source of the idea on Shrapnel. But, my point is that other people have thought of ideas like this before you. PvK may very well have thought of them before you, or you may have thought of them before him. Do not be so concerned over "mine mine mine". I am certain that there are lots of good ideas in people's personal mods that have not been posted anywhere on the net. If it is a good idea, chances are that a number of people will have thought of it concurrently. Isaac Newton and... umm... I forget the other guy's name... but anyways, both of them developed calculus simultaneously. Neither of them copied or stole from the other. It looks like the same kind of thing has happened here.

[ March 14, 2003, 00:05: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[JLS]

You make a valid Point, in regards to who thought of what first. Fryon.
Thanks

~
Actually, Fighters in Tactical Fighter Mod, do not move 1 in strategic move minimum, and do not have a command that would allow a move! Basically, just sentry and Fleet!

[ March 14, 2003, 01:36: Message edited by: JLS ]

[PvK]

JLS,

if I had time to respond to those kinds of Posts, I would still probably mostly ignore them, and do something else with my time. I certainly don't have time nor any interest to pore over your entire mod looking for "my code" and checking where you gave credit or not.

Also, much of the reason I have continued to add so much to Proportions, is that so far the modding community here had been very courteous and sharing of ideas. If I mention that something someone is discussing is something I've considered or worked on as well, it's not to say, "I thought of it before you - nyah nyah" - it's for interest's sake, to show I was of like-mind, and to offer discussion of ideas I'm interested in and would like to see realized in a fun mod.

However, I think part of your ... concern ... here is based on a misunderstanding on my part, and a misreading of my post by you. As I wrote in my Last post, I haven't had time to look at AIC yet, and I was asking you if I was right that it was a refinement of your "AI Balance" Version of Proportions - I thought that's what it probably was.

Regarding why there is so much I had planned or partly done for Foundations, and why it's not in Proportions, I've explained that before in several places. Basically, I like to release things that I think are relatively complete and work well together, and many of these other ideas involve a lot of careful work to get right by my standards, and may be interrelated. Also, I think I've mostly done what I set out to do in Proportions, so if I were to invest a lot more time in modding, I'd want to do something besides just tweak things one at a time. I'd probably want to make several major changes at once, and that's not something I want to start by posting little bits at a time, which would have various unintended side-effects.

Anyway, I'm sorry to see you apparently upset.

PvK

[Fyron]

Actually, Fighters in Tactical Fighter Mod, do not move 1 in strategic move minimum, and do not have a command that would allow a move! Basically, just sentry and Fleet!

I'll have to see how you accomplished that.

Hmm... more engines per move than they can get move points... beautiful.

[ March 14, 2003, 03:39: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[Aloofi]

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
I'll have to see how you accomplished that.

Hmm... more engines per move than they can get move points... beautiful.

I think its just changing movement per engine to zero......